Morbyd
Moderator
How can it be called Monogamy if each player has so many rings?There is a board game called monogamy, I shi7 you not
Does monogamy exist?
- Thread starter Robder
- Start date
Will consider myself put in my place sir. (or is it a box?)
Apologies if I appear blinkered and unable to see other points of view.
However
It's not a doctrine - it's an experience, albeit my own, however closed (or open as you put it).
We might come from different places but you can't deny this to be an interesting conversation. I might speak for myself here but am personally loving reading everyone's take on it - each opinion as valid as the next.
Coming into this experience as a gay man is really interesting - being told that what we practice goes against what's acceptable and normal, we're forced to become anarchists in our own way. Some people think gay marriage is the way forward but I think it's important to question modern relationship ideals and decide what works and what doesn't.
It's also not a line - it's me being brutally honest. I can't speak for others but I know exactly how I'd act if I chose to conform to the monogomy idea (which like it or not is pushed onto us by our culture).
I'd enjoy the challenge at first because I'm capable of falling in love too (just by the way).
...but then after a few years I'd start looking around despite myself.
I'd want to be honest with my partner but wouldn't feel able. I also wouldn't want them to be experiencing these same guilty thoughts so I'd try suppress my own.
Through not being acknowledged or expressed, that misdirected voice from my groin would get louder and I'd either explode with anger or create my own little world of guilt ridden clandestine behaviour. The guilt that followed would be enough to deter me from doing it again - and then five years later [of intimacy with the same person] I'd want to dabble again.
It's normal to function in this way - lust needs to be understood and expressed. If this happens through communication within a relationship (or al fresco sh@gging in bird sanctuaries
I'm not trying to be taboo - there's nothing taboo about listening to your body's natural urges.
Refuse to draw a line under the conversation either so please continue.
Fair enough
.
Buckley
Well-Known Member
Will consider myself put in my place sir. (or is it a box?)
Apologies if I appear blinkered and unable to see other points of view.
Refuse to draw a line under the conversation either so please continue.
It is interesting but it's disingenious to assume that people in monagamous relationships aren't fully aware of each other's desires for others. My current ladyee caught me out with evidence of my promiscuity 8 years ago. She's no under illusions that I fancy about half the women I meet and that if I was single I'd be a 'top shagger'
again. She reminded me was how dismayed I was when she went and had a revenge shag with an Italian Stallion who called her 'the f*** of the century'. I can laugh about it now but at the time it was terrible. This time out we admit it - we both fancy other people, we could both have other people, but we admit we don't want each other to touch anyone else. It's as instinctive to me to not want her f***ing around as it is for me to want to so, the so deal's an honest one, based on an understanding of our desires.
weloveliam@space
Active Member
How can it be called Monogamy if each player has so many rings?
Theyre penalties I presume, the more rings the worse you do !!
ps Good result sunday
( I couldnt watch as was out of town, but I did think of you and my other Chelsea firends )weloveliam@space
Active Member
It is interesting but it's disingenious to assume that people in monagamous relationships aren't fully aware of each other's desires for others. My current ladyee caught me out with evidence of my promiscuity 8 years ago. She's no under illusions that I fancy about half the women I meet and that if I was single I'd be a 'top shagger'
This time out we admit it - we both fancy other people, we could both have other people, but we admit we don't want each other to touch anyone else. It's as instinctive to me to not want her f***ing around as it is for me to want to so, the so deal's an honest one, based on an understanding of our desires.
In a nutshell if you had stayed together in the first place theres no way either of you could have been faithful. But now you f***ed half of london between you you can live a happy monogamous life together!?!
Well good luck to you both
It is interesting but it's disingenious to assume that people in monagamous relationships aren't fully aware of each other's desires for others. My current ladyee caught me out with evidence of my promiscuity 8 years ago. She's no under illusions that I fancy about half the women I meet and that if I was single I'd be a 'top shagger'
This time out we admit it - we both fancy other people, we could both have other people, but we admit we don't want each other to touch anyone else. It's as instinctive to me to not want her f***ing around as it is for me to want to so, the so deal's an honest one, based on an understanding of our desires.
No personal assumptions made.
However, you have just volunteered yourself as a text book perfect example in your first paragraph.
- and like it or not, you appear to have benefited from the experience. Horrid as the resulting fallout must've been, it opened up a channel of communication which appears to have deepened your relationship.
But who the feck am I to start dissecting your experiences so I'll stop there to avoid treading on dangerous turf.
Respect due for the honesty too btw.
Buckley
Well-Known Member
In a nutshell if you had stayed together in the first place theres no way either of you could have been faithful. But now you f***ed half of london between you you can live a happy monogamous life together!?!
Well good luck to you both
Yeah, possibly. Christ know how people that go out at school and stay together manage. I know my current missus would be out the door like a rocket if my full sexual repetoire had been learned from only one person. You couldn't possibly be much cop could you?
Last edited by a moderator:
Beckiboo
Active Member
ok I've skipped a few pages of reading so forgive me if I've missed any key facts out lol.
But... ROBDER
You are assuming that the sex people have in polygamous relationships is going to be AMAZING and so much better than the "boring" sex people have in monogamous relationships. Who's to say that if someone has sex with 10 different people once rather than 10 times with the same person it's going to be any way better... infact it could be much worse!
The amount of single friends I have who moan about their dire sexual experiences when playing the field. Ok you get the rare story from someone who has had a night of wonderment with a sexy new partner they met recently but generally the stories I hear about singledom give me nothing to think that I'm really missing anything.
I guess it's just uncool to stay monogamous and remain faithful to one partner, and much cooler to be out "embracing your sexuality" if that's what you call it.
But my personal view is its horses for courses. You can have a crap and boring sex life being polygamous OR monogamous. Going out shagging around can I'm sure get boring and repetitive after a while, so can lying in the same bed like a sack of spuds every night.
Yes you are blinkered and yes you are putting people into boxes! Why does it have to be one thing is right and one thing is wrong?
It's whatever someone wants to do at that point in their lives. Noone should feel pressurised to go around shagging different people anymore than they should feel they have to stay faithful (although, if you dont want to stay faithful at least let your girl/boyfriend know first)
Now stop this nonsense, that's quite enough for a Wednesday afternoon.
But... ROBDER
You are assuming that the sex people have in polygamous relationships is going to be AMAZING and so much better than the "boring" sex people have in monogamous relationships. Who's to say that if someone has sex with 10 different people once rather than 10 times with the same person it's going to be any way better... infact it could be much worse!The amount of single friends I have who moan about their dire sexual experiences when playing the field. Ok you get the rare story from someone who has had a night of wonderment with a sexy new partner they met recently
but generally the stories I hear about singledom give me nothing to think that I'm really missing anything.I guess it's just uncool to stay monogamous and remain faithful to one partner, and much cooler to be out "embracing your sexuality" if that's what you call it.
But my personal view is its horses for courses. You can have a crap and boring sex life being polygamous OR monogamous. Going out shagging around can I'm sure get boring and repetitive after a while, so can lying in the same bed like a sack of spuds every night.
Yes you are blinkered and yes you are putting people into boxes! Why does it have to be one thing is right and one thing is wrong?
It's whatever someone wants to do at that point in their lives. Noone should feel pressurised to go around shagging different people anymore than they should feel they have to stay faithful (although, if you dont want to stay faithful at least let your girl/boyfriend know first) Now stop this nonsense, that's quite enough for a Wednesday afternoon.
Boardgrrrrl
Active Member
You're damned if you do, damned if you don't where this thread is concerned.
Beckiboo
Active Member
Miss Boo, you do realise that Rob now thinks that rant was born of frustration, right?
I just don't like being referred to as a rose pruner, or whatever derogatory term he used for us monogamists!
WeLuvIbiza
Active Member
Sky 240 @ 10pm
Sister Wives. Guy has four wives, all aware and consenting with the others. Theres a conundrum.
Is he a monogamist or a man whore?
Sister Wives. Guy has four wives, all aware and consenting with the others. Theres a conundrum.
Is he a monogamist or a man whore?
Miss Boo, you do realise that Rob now thinks that rant was born of frustration, right?
Exactly!
No one ever said that polygamous relationships had 'better' sex. I was just pointing out that it's a natural human instinct - nothing cool or particularly edgy about that.
Nor did anyone say monogamy was wrong. I was just acknowledging the fact of the matter - which is that it's a man made tradition, the mass failure of which is clearly backed up by divorce stats (but that's not to say it doesn't work for some).
The point you make about the state of casual sex in our country is a general one which applies across the board (and exists on the gay scene too) - but the origins of this are an entirely different conversation.
The fact that the subject has provoked reaction in people is the interesting part.
Beckiboo
Active Member
I forgot I'd be coming in this morning and have a reply to this
I think a key thing is men vs women. It's a FACT that men are more controlled by their nether regions than women. Ok you might find the rare one lady who just thinks about sex and not anything further, but the majority of women are more concerned with love, relationships, respect yadah yadah. I think women are much more able to be in a relationship and look at at another guy and go "phhwooarr he's nice" without actually acting on it. Whereas a man (if given the chance) I think would find it much harder to restrain themselves. I guess women just have more morals I guess
I KNOW there are the exceptions, but if you took 1000 men and 1000 women this is what you'd find IMO.
I guess that's why it's harder for men to stay in a monogamous relationship and probably does go against their natural urges. But like most of the guys on this board have said, if it means having a lasting relationship with the woman they've chosen to be with, they can control it.
Rob - are you saying that if you were with someone who unequivocally (wow thats a big word for 9.30am) said they wanted a monogamous relationship, you would still go against this just because it's your "natural instinct"... even if it meant you would lose the person you loved?
And I know you may think I'm a fustrated old housewife
but I genuinely do think it's different for us girls... we just don't have those animal urges to go and mate with everything! Dates back to the caveman days I guess when you guys use to have to bosh us over the head with a rock just to have your wicked way with us WeLuvIbiza
Active Member
Young women 'have more sexual partners' than men
Young women are more promiscuous than men, according to a survey that claims the average 21-year-old has had nine sexual partners compared with seven for men.
By Martin Beckford, Social Affairs Correspondent 8:49PM GMT 08 Dec 2008
The poll of 2,000 by the magazine More also found that one in four young women has slept with more than 10 people, compared with one in five men who had done the same.
In addition, half of those questioned admitted they had been unfaithful, whereas only a quarter said they had been cheated on by a boyfriend.
It comes just a week after an academic study branded Britain one of the casual sex capitals of the Western world, with residents having more one-night stands and more liberal attitudes than those in Australia, France, the Netherlands, Italy and the US.
source http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...women-have-more-sexual-partners-than-men.html
Times are changing.....
Young women are more promiscuous than men, according to a survey that claims the average 21-year-old has had nine sexual partners compared with seven for men.
By Martin Beckford, Social Affairs Correspondent 8:49PM GMT 08 Dec 2008
The poll of 2,000 by the magazine More also found that one in four young women has slept with more than 10 people, compared with one in five men who had done the same.
In addition, half of those questioned admitted they had been unfaithful, whereas only a quarter said they had been cheated on by a boyfriend.
It comes just a week after an academic study branded Britain one of the casual sex capitals of the Western world, with residents having more one-night stands and more liberal attitudes than those in Australia, France, the Netherlands, Italy and the US.
source http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...women-have-more-sexual-partners-than-men.html
Times are changing.....
I forgot I'd be coming in this morning and have a reply to this
I think a key thing is men vs women. It's a FACT that men are more controlled by their nether regions than women. Ok you might find the rare one lady who just thinks about sex and not anything further, but the majority of women are more concerned with love, relationships, respect yadah yadah. I think women are much more able to be in a relationship and look at at another guy and go "phhwooarr he's nice" without actually acting on it. Whereas a man (if given the chance) I think would find it much harder to restrain themselves. I guess women just have more morals I guess
I KNOW there are the exceptions, but if you took 1000 men and 1000 women this is what you'd find IMO.
I guess that's why it's harder for men to stay in a monogamous relationship and probably does go against their natural urges. But like most of the guys on this board have said, if it means having a lasting relationship with the woman they've chosen to be with, they can control it.
Rob - are you saying that if you were with someone who unequivocally (wow thats a big word for 9.30am) said they wanted a monogamous relationship, you would still go against this just because it's your "natural instinct"... even if it meant you would lose the person you loved?
And I know you may think I'm a fustrated old housewife
Most convincing counter argument yet!
Arrived at work late so will respond later.
(loving this debate)
OK here goes:
I don't buy into mars/venus stereotypes. Sadly we don't live in a culture that celebrates gender diversity at all. Gender stereotyping affects everyone regardless of where we sit on the spectrum and we're miiiiiiiles away from gender equality.
(Five minutes of MTV Base will tell you this.)
Alpha males do exist, but most men only pretend to be and those that don't are ridiculed and accused of being gay.
Even within trans communities - post op male to female transexuals are expected to wear dresses and makeup. Why should they feel forced to do this...even within their own networks?
In our culture, men aren't allowed to express their feminine side for fear of being seen as weak or a lesser person. Gay men feel more able to express this side of themselves because they don't have the same cultural restraints put on them (but they are still rampant because you only have to look at the stupid muscle mary obsession
).
The whole reason for writing the post in the first place was to inject a bit of girl power into the debate. Men constantly congratulate each other for being promiscuous (to the point of being destructive with it) whereas women are universally seen as 'sluts'... not particularly fair imo.
...
This is where Tantric/Taoist teachings get really interesting...
(apol for being so graphic but it's necessary if we're resorting to the biology argument.)
Women use up their vital energy through the production of eggs during menstruation and experience fatigue at certain times of the month. The equivalent in males is the production of sperm - and releasing this results in immediate fatigue.
The western male approach to sex is pretty naff because it's entirely focused on the groin area. The goal is to reach orgasm and complete by ejaculating as quickly as possible. The underlying aim is to satisfy a primal urge and most men remain stuck in this place.
Women on the other hand are culturally much more empathic and are able to connect their sexual organs with other parts of the body. Merging the lower regions with the upper, more emotional areas makes for a much more multi-orgasmic experience - which is why women talk of full body orgasms etc. The fact is, men are capable of this too but they choose not to explore through fear of revealing their feminine side. Much of this is repressed and stays in lock down at the base of the spine for years.
The obsession with ejaculation isn't really good for health as the long term effect of constant fatigue is premature ageing.
(Allegedly) moving sexual energy around the body and seperating the experience of orgasm from ejaculation (which comes more naturally to woman) is key to longevity.
Fascinating stuff in our guilt ridden GOD IS A MAN culture (or I think so anyway).
Disclaimer: I'm not Sting and don't profess to be adept at any of the above...but early days though eh?
...
So - back to the point before I wind up in a verbal cul-de-sac miles away from anywhere...
I never discredited the experience of sex with a long term partner - how can a one time experience ever be half as good if you don't know how to push their buttons? It's a fair point but this doesn't relate to the polygamy vs monogamy argument - i.e. - a meaningful relationship is more than possible within a polygamus framework.
...
I thought your question was good - what on earth would I do if my partner was insisting on being monogamous? Welllll tbh that would be a huge challenge for me and I'd have no choice but to try to communicate this as much as possible, as early as possible (easier said than done and a point which has already been raised in this thread).
You nailed it with this part:
...
...and finally - it's very difficult to hold my own in this thread because in reality who the fu(k is going to be stupid enough to go on a public message board and admit they've had an affair recently?
I don't buy into mars/venus stereotypes. Sadly we don't live in a culture that celebrates gender diversity at all. Gender stereotyping affects everyone regardless of where we sit on the spectrum and we're miiiiiiiles away from gender equality.
(Five minutes of MTV Base will tell you this.)
Alpha males do exist, but most men only pretend to be and those that don't are ridiculed and accused of being gay.
Even within trans communities - post op male to female transexuals are expected to wear dresses and makeup. Why should they feel forced to do this...even within their own networks?
In our culture, men aren't allowed to express their feminine side for fear of being seen as weak or a lesser person. Gay men feel more able to express this side of themselves because they don't have the same cultural restraints put on them (but they are still rampant because you only have to look at the stupid muscle mary obsession
).The whole reason for writing the post in the first place was to inject a bit of girl power into the debate. Men constantly congratulate each other for being promiscuous (to the point of being destructive with it) whereas women are universally seen as 'sluts'... not particularly fair imo.
...
This is where Tantric/Taoist teachings get really interesting...
(apol for being so graphic but it's necessary if we're resorting to the biology argument.)
Women use up their vital energy through the production of eggs during menstruation and experience fatigue at certain times of the month. The equivalent in males is the production of sperm - and releasing this results in immediate fatigue.
The western male approach to sex is pretty naff because it's entirely focused on the groin area. The goal is to reach orgasm and complete by ejaculating as quickly as possible. The underlying aim is to satisfy a primal urge and most men remain stuck in this place.
Women on the other hand are culturally much more empathic and are able to connect their sexual organs with other parts of the body. Merging the lower regions with the upper, more emotional areas makes for a much more multi-orgasmic experience - which is why women talk of full body orgasms etc. The fact is, men are capable of this too but they choose not to explore through fear of revealing their feminine side. Much of this is repressed and stays in lock down at the base of the spine for years.
The obsession with ejaculation isn't really good for health as the long term effect of constant fatigue is premature ageing.
(Allegedly) moving sexual energy around the body and seperating the experience of orgasm from ejaculation (which comes more naturally to woman) is key to longevity.
Fascinating stuff in our guilt ridden GOD IS A MAN culture (or I think so anyway).
Disclaimer: I'm not Sting and don't profess to be adept at any of the above...but early days though eh?
...
So - back to the point before I wind up in a verbal cul-de-sac miles away from anywhere...
I never discredited the experience of sex with a long term partner - how can a one time experience ever be half as good if you don't know how to push their buttons? It's a fair point but this doesn't relate to the polygamy vs monogamy argument - i.e. - a meaningful relationship is more than possible within a polygamus framework.
...
I thought your question was good - what on earth would I do if my partner was insisting on being monogamous? Welllll tbh that would be a huge challenge for me and I'd have no choice but to try to communicate this as much as possible, as early as possible (easier said than done and a point which has already been raised in this thread).
You nailed it with this part:
Beckiboo said:
...
...and finally - it's very difficult to hold my own in this thread because in reality who the fu(k is going to be stupid enough to go on a public message board and admit they've had an affair recently?
agentundercover
Active Member
i've banged lots of people but only want to bang one now, i have the self control to do this (because believe me they are beating a path
) as the flip side is a great life with an amazing woman.it's not complicated.
HOWEVER. The above quote i will take with me forever. No one has ever sounded like a smutty version of my late granmother more.