jimmiz
Well-Known Member
Chiringuito, edited for you ??Edited this for you
#Brexit
- Thread starter Fronty
- Start date
claretclubber
Well-Known Member
Think the right (Cons/BP) will unfortunately take control of additional seats.
Ikoda
Well-Known Member
I'm not so sure. The Brexit Party seem to be contesting all the seats in the country if there's no pact with the Conservatives (which Johnson has ruled out) so actually, it may split the Leave vote somewhat. Probably not enough for Brexit Party to win any seats, but enough that a more left or centre leaning party might pick up a seat or two.
Definite won't see a Labour Landslide ala 1997
Kim Wrong Un
Active Member
a useful guide to tactical voting for those opposed to leaving the EU
https://www.bestforbritain.org/
https://www.bestforbritain.org/
johndiamond
Active Member
Whatever your beliefs, please make sure you vote or even just turn up to get your ballot paper and spoil it if you must.
But please vote guys. People DIED for us to have the right to vote, and the apathy people show in the uk these days is a shame.
But please vote guys. People DIED for us to have the right to vote, and the apathy people show in the uk these days is a shame.
Here. here @johndiamond
Also, can we not make this GE about Brexit? How about we make it about things that are more important, like our national health service, mental health services, funding for public services.
Wherever you sit on the Brexit debate, if you honestly asked yourself 5 years ago if you considered it important, I'd bet you'd say you'd never given our membership of the EU a second thought.
Brexit has become the great distraction. A very convenient smokescreen for the political establishment to bury everything else. It dominates our news and political discourse, but at the expense of what?
Also, can we not make this GE about Brexit? How about we make it about things that are more important, like our national health service, mental health services, funding for public services.
Wherever you sit on the Brexit debate, if you honestly asked yourself 5 years ago if you considered it important, I'd bet you'd say you'd never given our membership of the EU a second thought.
Brexit has become the great distraction. A very convenient smokescreen for the political establishment to bury everything else. It dominates our news and political discourse, but at the expense of what?
Kim Wrong Un
Active Member
the problem is that the quality of life for Brits could change dramatically if/when it happens. all the other stuff depends on the amount of tax coming in. IF car makers, banks, entrepreneurs, pharmas, international students, nurses, doctors and other skilled labour all leave (or are unable to enter) the UK after whatever is finally decided, and if massive price rises in imports lead to massive inflation, then that will have a massive impact on the economy... so in a sense, it is the only issue in town because everything else rides on it. this is why it is dishonest of Corbyn (depending on his mood) to pretend A. that the issue doesn't exist or B. that he will get anything better out of talks because he really won't.
I don't disagree with you Olly, but the topic itself is too polarising and people have bought into the hype machine, either way. Stay or leave, the electorate has been mobilised. That's why I fear more working class people on low incomes are going to swerve Labour or the Lib Dems than ever before.
"Policies before personalities" rings truer than ever before (I mean, I find leaders of both the big parties detestable toads for different reasons, but we need to look beyond it)
"Policies before personalities" rings truer than ever before (I mean, I find leaders of both the big parties detestable toads for different reasons, but we need to look beyond it)
Kim Wrong Un
Active Member
I'd personally go with the libdems this time but with no great enthusiasm...
the tories might be the problem but corbyn's not the solution
a shocking field all round
the tories might be the problem but corbyn's not the solution
a shocking field all round
kimajy
Well-Known Member
Agree but the one time in my life I voted LibDem they turned out to be the most poisonous influence on the lifeblood of Britain, its students and entrepreneurs, that we have seen in a very long time. The irony about Labour being seen as a party of the working class is that where taxing the middle class (not the uber rich) by stealth is concerned, both the Tories and the LibDems have done more damage to their pockets in 8 years than the previous centerist labour governments ever did.
Adding yet further fuel to that fire with a far-left Labour Government is likely the straw which breaks the camel's back for many, and I can see a big brain drain and collapse in entrepreneurial activity on the way if Labour now ride in to raid what's left of peoples' financial futures. Not to mention the utter annihilation of pensions in the public and private sectors that's already taking place and can only get worse. It's getting to the point where with our access to Europe cut off by Brexit, many in UK may as well look forward to being on the checkouts at B&Q till they're 67 and shopping at Lidl. Isn't that a cheery thought to inspire optimism about the future ? ?
Kim Wrong Un
Active Member
yep
I agree that the lib dems are total snakes in the grass and I would vote for them with all the enthusiasm of a prospective amputee
but the other options though. christ on a bike...
Don Simon
Well-Known Member
Looked at this last Wednesday; 30th, turns out my best bet for a tactical vote is to vote for the same person I voted for last time.
This was a Labour MP with a large majority who is a firm remainer, Lib Dems polled poorly. Not convinced by Labour's recent performance but I'd be shooting myself in the foot (brexiter style) if I voted for anyone else.
It absolutely has to be about Brexit IMO because that's the way the politicians have made it. Brexit is an irreversible decision that will affect the UK for decades and it has to be sorted out one way of the other. The sensible way would have been a second referendum and a GE but as they have ruled out the former the latter has become a proxy for it, as it must.
I think it's incredibly dangerous. People are passionate about Brexit, understandably. But the overwhelming majority of people need access to healthcare without a premium. How much of a sorry state will large swathes of the electorate be, if they decide to place their votes based on Brexit, rather than the fact of whether they can afford health insurance moving forward?
Kim Wrong Un
Active Member
was listening to Trump on the Farage LBC show (I know... nothing is too surreal anymore) claiming the US had no interest in the NHS and giving this air of never even having heard of the NHS... hmmm!
Johnny Vodka
Well-Known Member
Brexit isn't just a status. it's something that will take the UK in all sorts of horrible directions.
Right. And the NHS will be one of the first victims of Brexit, probably lost forever within 5-10 years. The predicted financial loss that the UK will face post-Brexit will mean more food banks, more poverty, more homelessness and more deaths, regardless of who is in charge. Brexit is by far and away the biggest issue facing the country and nothing the politicians on either side promise can ever be funded if we leave, especially with no deal, so whatever national policies people vote for in this election could well be nothing more than empty promises and undeliverable vapour-ware.
As I've said, I agree the GE and Brexit should have been separated and decided with separate votes, but our politicians have decided they won't be so the only way to fight Brexit and the lasting damage it will cause is via the GE.
Whilst I agree with the essence of all that you say, the trouble with making it about Brexit is that people will just vote the same way. It's too much of a hot potato and complete numbs a lot of people from the wider consequences. We need to take the discourse away from those emotionally-charged opinions, and bring the discussion back to everyday, real-life
You say "Brexit" - and you immediately have a divisive topic where, by now, very few people are going to be swayed to change their mind.
You start picking apart what the actual candidates are offering, the pros and cons of each side, what really matters and suddenly you have a much more constructive basis that won't descend into the "we won, you lost get over it" or "project fear" or "I voted remain, but now I just want us out" rhetoric.
You say "Brexit" - and you immediately have a divisive topic where, by now, very few people are going to be swayed to change their mind.
You start picking apart what the actual candidates are offering, the pros and cons of each side, what really matters and suddenly you have a much more constructive basis that won't descend into the "we won, you lost get over it" or "project fear" or "I voted remain, but now I just want us out" rhetoric.