Politics - UK - 2017

I think one of the biggest problems we have is the voting system. Atm in a GE we have first past the post,but I think alternative vote would represent the voters better. I think that's right,it gets a bit complicated to explain it. Look it up :)
 
Tbh, I wouldn't be surprised if any of the opposition parties are hoping they do badly... whomever is in power and negotiates brexit is gonna be hated in the next election regardless which side of the brexit fence you are on (assuming the world doesn't collapse and we end up in a dictatorship :confused: )
 
Brexit is going to be a disaster financially anyway. There's no sense that EU bods are going to give May an easy time. Still, the Tories will make sure the poor, disabled and working class do the worst financially out of it, while the rich are cushioned.
 
Good ol' Tony! Just drag politics to the right then

Like it or not the centre (right) will win its 10th UK election since 1979.

Labour only ever won when they moved to the right and got Tory voters to back them.

So while I see a lot of attractive things in Labours offering, people will reject it and basically Margaret Thatcher will win her 10th UK election next month....
 
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Still, the Tories will make sure the poor, disabled and working class do the worst financially out of it, while the rich are cushioned.

Wouldn't it be fair to break down these segments of society a little further though? For example:-

Poor - a large proportion of this catagory are poor because they are lazy, have no ambition etc.

Rich - a large proportion of this category are rich because they have worked their arses off for most of their lives, built up successful businesses that provide probably well over 75% of the job market.

Why should the 'rich' be penalised and the 'poor' be rewarded?!? I've never understood this?

I'm sure there are lots of people who would like to live in a society where everyone is totally equal but it just wouldn't work. With no incentive for those who have ambition, unemployment would skyrocket and the economy collapse very quickly.
 
If Labour had the sense to vote David miliband as their party leader a few years ago. Then you'd have had a much better chance of a labour government right now.

But they couldn't even get that right. And it's been a downward spiral ever since.

Also once again the Left voting among us seem very upset and angry already. Chillout. You haven't lost yet!
 
Like it or not the centre (right) will win its 10th UK election since 1979

I wouldn't call Mays government centre right,they are right wing. And everyone is going to find that out soon enough.

Labour only ever won when they moved to the right and got Tory voters to back them

Labour won in 97,because of 18yrs of shit under the torys. Blair then went on to lose,and lose 4 million votes in 13 years. Labour voters not tory voters. Blairs government lost Scotland. Blair is the reason the labour party are so devided.

So while I see a lot of attractive things in Labours offering, people will reject it and basically Margaret Thatcher will win her 10th UK election next month

Yes,I know. The turkeys will vote for Christmas. But do you want to be a turkey,just so you can be on the winning side?
 
Poor - a large proportion of this catagory are poor because they are lazy, have no ambition etc.

Rich - a large proportion of this category are rich because they have worked their arses off for most of their lives, built up successful businesses that provide probably well over 75% of the job market.

Looks like someone has swallowed Tory propaganda. More and more (hard) working people are in poverty. You also have to consider income as it relates to property prices, and also inherited wealth. Then consider those who can't work due to disability or illness and are having their benefits cut.

I don't think anyone wants a society where everyone is equal in the way you seem to suggest, but reducing the gap between the richest and the poorest and making sure everyone has access to decent public services should be an aim.
 
Poor - a large proportion of this catagory are poor because they are lazy, have no ambition etc

Poor - a small proportion of this category are lazy,and have no ambition etc. The rest are in low paid jobs,zero hour contracts,have a poor education,struggle to pay their rent a d put food on the table. They could be disabled. Female. Single mothers. They could have made a few bad descision when they were younger. The list is endless..

Rich - a large proportion of this category are rich because they have worked their arses off for most of their lives, built up successful businesses that provide probably well over 75% of the job market

Rich - a large proportion of this catergory are lazy,have inhereted wealth. Have had a good education,daddy has friend in high places,they're not dissabled,few are on zero hours contracts. Basically they've had a good start in life. Probably white,not a single parent. And if they want to live in a good society they should contribute to it.

Why should the 'rich' be penalised and the 'poor' be rewarded?!? I've never understood this?

Why should the poor,and working classes be penalised for doing the hardest work/jobs. And the rich get rewarded with tax breaks. I've never understood this?
 
Poor - a small proportion of this category are lazy,and have no ambition etc. The rest are in low paid jobs,zero hour contracts,have a poor education,struggle to pay their rent a d put food on the table. They could be disabled. Female. Single mothers. They could have made a few bad descision when they were younger. The list is endless..



Rich - a large proportion of this catergory are lazy,have inhereted wealth. Have had a good education,daddy has friend in high places,they're not dissabled,few are on zero hours contracts. Basically they've had a good start in life. Probably white,not a single parent. And if they want to live in a good society they should contribute to it.



Why should the poor,and working classes be penalised for doing the hardest work/jobs. And the rich get rewarded with tax breaks. I've never understood this?


Too much to disagree with. The sweeping generalisation is a joke.

I'm working class. Have been kicked out of home as a teenager. Slept rough. Lived in a hostel for a year. I don't despise the rich. I don't feel particularly penalised by the Conservative government. I've felt more penalised by a labour government and their relentless crusade against the motorist.

I've found Ed Miliband and Ed Balls completely uninspiring. Jeremy Corbyn and John Mcdonnell are in my opinion completely inadequate to run the country. The Labour party have spent the past two years trying to remove their party leader.

While I'm not a massive fan of Philip Hammond and Theresa May. For me at least I'd give them the nod over anyone else at the moment.

At the end of the day no one party is going to keep everyone happy. I just think people don't vote for a certain party just because of the party name. Regardless of who's leading that party and what they might offer.
 
What has pissed me off with the Torys was the cheek to rise NI after they pledged not too in their previous manifesto, as if being self employed isn't hard enough. There isn't a strong opposition to compete either, I have no faith in Labour nor this current Tory party.

I understand that folk will be voting Tory to push Brexit through and that they will win by a landslide but i'm not sure who to vote at the moment.
 
Wouldn't it be fair to break down these segments of society a little further though? For example:-

Poor - a large proportion of this catagory are poor because they are lazy, have no ambition etc.

Rich - a large proportion of this category are rich because they have worked their arses off for most of their lives, built up successful businesses that provide probably well over 75% of the job market.

Why should the 'rich' be penalised and the 'poor' be rewarded?!? I've never understood this?

I'm sure there are lots of people who would like to live in a society where everyone is totally equal but it just wouldn't work. With no incentive for those who have ambition, unemployment would skyrocket and the economy collapse very quickly.

Many above have given examples what's wrong with this. There are some lazy poor on benefits and few hardworking rich, but that's it.

The Philip Greens of this world who cash out large sums from a business, bleeding it dry and leaving it with a massive pensions whole. Or a direct experienced example where my father worked: original boss worked hard and looked after staff, son inherited, didn't do much and the staff only got a 4p per hour pay rise in 5 years sighting bad economic times.... same time where he got a new luxury car every 6 months and built a multimillion pound mansion :eek:

The rich have more options, the rest don't in reality have the luxury of been able to switch jobs to a better employer.

It's not the 99% begrudge rich been rich (well I don't), it's when they avoid tax and don't contribute back to what they have gained from society. Vodafone avoided a ~£9 billion tax bill and negotiated a far smaller settlement. Try doing that earning £16k a year... Think you'd have your collar felt lol. Probably why government it looking at self employment tax now as more people are using that loophole and tax revenues are down.

And before anyone says but businesses create jobs, true, but most would automate or get rid of jobs they don't need, they are for profit businesses after all (exactly this happening where I work). But using that logic shouldn't end consumers pay 0% tax; without them they would be no businesses in the first place. :rolleyes:

No one who's sane want everyone to have exactly the same, but also you need to not buy into the bullshit that if you work really hard you can be a millionaire either; if everyone was a millionaire how much would a loaf of bread cost? Hence we have a range of wealth.

I just think people forget what the tax system is for and represents or is supposed to, and why it is seemingly ok to avoid tax if you're rich or a company.

It's not in the riches interest long term either; zero hours contracts, automaton etc, as eluded above, who's gonna buy the goods or services that makes businesses rich if the poor are bled dry to fund remaining services, housing etc? Or we looking at going back to indentured servitude?

Ps: trickle down economics has been proven to be false, even noble laureate economic peeps have said as much, it actually in long term has a slight trickle up effect.

Anyhow that's me done for this thread :D
 
Wouldn't it be fair to break down these segments of society a little further though? For example:-

Poor - a large proportion of this catagory are poor because they are lazy, have no ambition etc.

Rich - a large proportion of this category are rich because they have worked their arses off for most of their lives, built up successful businesses that provide probably well over 75% of the job market.

Why should the 'rich' be penalised and the 'poor' be rewarded?!? I've never understood this?

I'm sure there are lots of people who would like to live in a society where everyone is totally equal but it just wouldn't work. With no incentive for those who have ambition, unemployment would skyrocket and the economy collapse very quickly.
Jesus Christ, my eyes are starting to bleed
 
I understand that folk will be voting Tory to push Brexit through and that they will win by a landslide but i'm not sure who to vote at the moment

That's why this GE is so dangerous. Everybody is thinking about brexit,and taking their eye off of the problems at home.
 
Sweeping generalisations. How about this one. All the poor are lazy. And all the rich work their arses.... :lol:



Blairites,I though you liked them?

Yep,it's official. You are one of those working class turkeys.


When did I say I liked anyone? I simply said Labour would have been better off installing David Miliband as party leader instead of Ed Miliband.

Also try and grow up a bit with the name calling. It isn't going to win over any fans......
 
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