im gonna vote for...........

[sexki11en]

And BTW, so are the people of Iraq these days

at what cost?

nearly 100 UK Troops DEAD.
lord knows how many Iraqis.

Margarat Hassan, Ken Bigley... need i go on?

£6 Billion and counting. (suppose whe can recoup some of this with the slice of the black liquid milkshake on offer).

Falling on deaf ears chewie hun. No one really opposes this war unless they've lost someone in it. I nearly lost a sister in the first one, I lost a cousin in the second one and have lost a very good friend in this one - now someone tell me that this war has anything to do with us and that we should keep on loosing our people???

 

[djchewie]

And your Mr. Howard said the other day that even with ALL the information that he has NOW he still would support military action in Iraq.

he also added, that he would have gone through it with UN Support (fat lot of good that would have been anyway), and gone to War for non-complaince of UN wotsit XXXX. not WMD fired from rockets that'll reach the UK in 40mins that dont exist.

 

[macdonsj]

our politics in the UK has become like the US politics

paraphrasing Bill Hicks

"I think the puppet on the left is my kinda guy"
"No, i prefer the puppet on the right"


Labour & Conservative are practically identical now - right down to the corruption & shagging that goes on.


If only Screaming Lord Sutch was still alive - he'd have a solution

 

[stuie]

I've wasted too much time talking on this thread!! I'm going to do some work and then I'll chat with you all again tomorrow!!

 

[kes]

Tax those that can afford to help the less fortunate... it's not rocket sceince really it isn't

why should i pay more tax to pay help the less fortunate.

if i want to donate to charity i will.

tell you what, you win the lottery and share the winnings with everyone who is unemployed in the whole of the country.


didnt think u would.

I'm not offering my entire income. And not asking anyone to depart with theirs.

I'm offering a part of it. I'm not saying tax higher earners into oblivion. We need captalism and competition. I'm just asking that we spend a little of the money on the less fortunate not spending it on those that don't need it.

Agreed Marxism is pants but check this.

Conservatives believe that people who have to go to bupa should have half their bill paid by the state. This would result in 2 billion pounds not being spent on those that can't afford the treament whatsoever in anyway shape or form period fullstop ever... are you getting it yet?????

They will DIE

That is the true essence of the conservatives. Thats is what i am against.

 

[jjinit]

our politics in the UK has become like the US politics

paraphrasing Bill Hicks

"I think the puppet on the left is my kinda guy"
"No, i prefer the puppet on the right"


Labour & Conservative are practically identical now - right down to the corruption & shagging that goes on.


If only Screaming Lord Sutch was still alive - he'd have a solution

you can still run for parliament from beyond the grave, look at John Major

 

[kes]

but some people use that as an excuse for not trying.

ive spoken to people who i went to school with. "you went to uni didnt you, i wish i paid more attention in class now", is what one guy who used to funk about said.

he didnt put the effort in then, and didnt realise his potential. so who's to blame? Thatcher?

I'm not referring to those. They can get funked as far as i'm concerned. As i said. The less fortunate not the fortunate who've funked up

Yet to have anyone invalidate my arguments

 

[Morbyd]

NITEFLY:

Glad someone is lightening up a bit in here. oi... it's getting hot!

 

[gfunk]

But the Labour government has not got good value out of the additional money they have spent, government bodies/civil service are incredibly inefficient/beaurocratic and this has only got worse under the Labour government so paying more tax is not necessarily the ultimate solution.
I wouldnt mind paying more tax if I didnt see examples every day of taxpayers money being almost criminally wasted!

 

[djchewie]

Conservatives believe that people who have to go to bupa should have half their bill paid by the state. This would result in 2 billion pounds not being spent on those that can't afford the treament whatsoever in anyway shape or form period fullstop ever... are you getting it yet?????

i think you'll find this policy my right honorable friend is designed so that if you can get treatment at a private hospital quicker than at a NHS one.


" will have access to treatment at any independent hospital which can perform their operation for NHS prices and to NHS standards.

Private patients have paid their taxes like everyone else. If they choose to go private and free up NHS space for other patients, they should not be punished, but helped. If an independent hospital charges more for an operation than the NHS, patients will be entitled to 50 per cent of the NHS cost as a contribution towards their bill."

its means a use of ALL resources available and doesnt affect the "poor" at all. means number 51 in the waiting list jumps up a place cos number 50 has paid in part to have their op done in order not to die.

i call it common sense.

 

[djchewie]

But the Labour government has not got good value out of the additional money they have spent, government bodies/civil service are incredibly inefficient/beaurocratic and this has only got worse under the Labour government so paying more tax is not necessarily the ultimate solution.
I wouldnt mind paying more tax if I didnt see examples every day of taxpayers money being almost criminally wasted!

here here...

twice as much money should equal to twice the results. not 30% (or whatever the platry figure is).

 

[Morbyd]

twice as much money should equal to twice the results. not 30% (or whatever the platry figure is).

Yes, but I think that might be intrinsic in your system too and no government is going to change it. Britain is over-regulated and over-complicated so you could triple spending and still not double results.

 

[djchewie]

twice as much money should equal to twice the results. not 30% (or whatever the platry figure is).

Yes, but I think that might be intrinsic in your system too and no government is going to change it. Britain is over-regulated and over-complicated so you could triple spending and still not double results.

cos half of it's spent "refurbishing" govt offices, charging dept names... (do u know how much a top agency charges to re-brand? - aint cheap i can tell ya).

ive done work for govt depts before, and the amount of undecisive BS, ego massaging that goes on is unreal. my old agency charged £100 p/h designing various brochures for various govt depts...

and to think its £15,000 of Taxpayers money being spent for some brochure highlighting certain subjects that i cant disclose.

 

[stuie]

i think you'll find this policy my right honorable friend is designed so that if you can get treatment at a private hospital quicker than at a NHS one.


" will have access to treatment at any independent hospital which can perform their operation for NHS prices and to NHS standards.

Private patients have paid their taxes like everyone else. If they choose to go private and free up NHS space for other patients, they should not be punished, but helped. If an independent hospital charges more for an operation than the NHS, patients will be entitled to 50 per cent of the NHS cost as a contribution towards their bill."

its means a use of ALL resources available and doesnt affect the "poor" at all. means number 51 in the waiting list jumps up a place cos number 50 has paid in part to have their op done in order not to die.

i call it common sense.

I paid £2800 for a private op last year, that i couldn't really afford but i still don't agree with that policy. those 50%'s they pay out should be going back into the NHS for improvements.

 

[djchewie]

I paid £2800 for a private op last year, that i couldn't really afford but i still don't agree with that policy. those 50%'s they pay out should be going back into the NHS for improvements.

why should it?

i cant afford private treatment, but if for a sake of £1000 that i can afford, which means i get the op done quicker than on the NHS, i know what id do.



or would u rather me die in the waiting list because i wasnt given that choice that the conservatives would make available?

 

[Lost Pom]

I would pay half of the fee for the op i am waiting for if it meant being seen quicker. This would aslo enable a person behind me on the list to be seen quicker. Someone tell me who wouldnt benefit from this?

 

[djchewie]

I would pay half of the fee for the op i am waiting for if it meant being seen quicker. This would aslo enable a person behind me on the list to be seen quicker. Someone tell me who wouldnt benefit from this?

here here. 8)

 

[MARKB]

Labour were criticised by the Tories recently after announcing approx. 100,000 job cuts within the civil service in order to stream line the public services, reduce wasted resources and cut back on unneccessary spending and beaurocracy. Discuss??

Farming people off to the private sector for healthcare is bullshit. We have a NHS - the priority should be to real committment to make it work, not circumvent the problem by helping people opt out of it.

 

[stuie]

We have a NHS - the priority should be to real committment to make it work, not circumvent the problem by helping people opt out of it.

exactly, that was my point but mark put it over a bit more articulately than me!

free at point of use NHS is what this country used to be so famous for, giving people money to go private isn't going to help long term.

on the other hand PFI hospitals that can perform the operations at same cost as NHS should be welcomed.

 

[djchewie]

exactly, that was my point but mark put it over a bit more articulately than me!

free at point of use NHS is what this country used to be so famous for, giving people money to go private isn't going to help long term.

on the other hand PFI hospitals that can perform the operations at same cost as NHS should be welcomed.

its not going to be compusory.

you need an op.

its gonna cost the NHS £2000.

u can get it done quicker private.

NHS pay £1000, you pay £1000.

NHS save £1000, ure out of pocket by £1000, but are still breathing, but its a choice youve made.

you have the op, recover in an MRSA free environment with TV/DVD and a playstation if yr lucky, and get to live and get on with your life.

its about CHOICE. if the capacity is there privately, why not use it!