☣ Coronavirus ☣

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We do not know yet if there will be thousands or millions of death MORE than other years with other influenza or corona type of viruses. The vast majority of people dying...would have died anyway in the coming 5 years because of underlying deceases or age.
We do know that the virus spreads so fast that the Intensive Care units all over the world have insufficient beds and personnel. So that's a problem I can see. But then I still hold the opinion the world has overreacted and we can't turn that back now. This will have a huge impact on the world and I truly doubt if that's worth it. It's ok to disagree, I'm not looking to make my point or something like that.
The world cannot keep this up for months to come. It's damaging the world harder than the virus would have.

Many politicians started out with this idea, but almost all of them have capitulated when faced with reality. A week ago Donald Trump wanted to open the country up by April 12th, yesterday he was telling Americans to expect 100,000-240,000 deaths with a successful lock down and over 2 million deaths without any mitigation. The idea we can save lives or the economy is a false choice. The economy was always going to get wrecked.

Even if you want to say Italy has 10x more cases than actually reported, that is still around 1 million out of 60 million people --- about 1.6% of the population and Italy was brought to its knees. I don't see how its reasonable to think the economy could function at 20, 30, 50% infection rates. But it goes even further than that... Political leaders, military high commands, doctors, professors / scientists, business leaders are disproportionately represented in older / high risk demographics. The experience and professional knowledge lost would be a drain on the economy for years.
 
Me too, but if it works pretty well, than I'll be f***ing mad at my gouvernement who took the decision to shot down and kill everything I love (including my job).

It's up to governments then to step in and make sure as many jobs are protected as possible. I'm currently working from home, on full pay, but I would imagine there could be cuts to public sector jobs (like mine) in the future because of this.

Honestly, many of us will just be happy if our grandparents or parents are still alive once this calms down.
 
Totaly agree with your comments (and we are NOT trying to proove a point).

Based on what evidence? There are no easy answers but what makes you think you're better qualified to comment than the actual experts in the field? I've no idea what your job is, but I dare say I'd get short-shrift from you if I rocked up one day, knowing f*** all about it, and started telling you you weren't doing it right.

There's definitely a cost associated with taking preventative measures, but I will trust actual experts on this one that the cure is not currently worse than the cause.

I also find the glibness with which people are willing to write off other people's lives because "they haven't got long anyway" quite appalling. Even more so because they're fed up with not being able to party for a couple of months, seriously?
 
Based on what evidence? There are no easy answers but what makes you think you're better qualified to comment than the actual experts in the field? I've no idea what your job is, but I dare say I'd get short-shrift from you if I rocked up one day, knowing f*** all about it, and started telling you you weren't doing it right.

There's definitely a cost associated with taking preventative measures, but I will trust actual experts on this one that the cure is not currently worse than the cause.

I also find the glibness with which people are willing to write off other people's lives because "they haven't got long anyway" quite appalling. Even more so because they're fed up with not being able to party for a couple of months, seriously?
We could have isolate only the people at true risk? Again, not trying to proove a point...
 
Me too, but if it works pretty well, than I'll be f***ing mad at my gouvernement who took the decision to shot down and kill everything I love (including my job).

From your article Dated March 30th: Two days ago, the Swedish Public Health Agency’s Karin Tegmark Wisell said in a radio interview that it was “too soon to tell” if the Swedish approach is proving successful.

Last weekend, public gatherings of more than 50 people were banned, in the the first sign that the increasing death rate may lead to a stricter approach from Swedish authorities.


In the two days since that article: 407 cases 34 deaths and 512 cases 59 deaths; which are the two worst days yet for Sweden by the numbers...
 
I also find the glibness with which people are willing to write off other people's lives because "they haven't got long anyway" quite appalling.

Our governments (and corporations) do this every day with our lives when considering new legislation or product safety. This discussion is now public because the trade-off is highly publicized and transparent. I think it is a good thing that this is now being debated in the open, by the public.

We will all now understand "how the sausage is made".
 
I think that the real issue will become the lack of preparation for testing during January / February for many countries whilst it appears Germany was gearing up and as such seem to have managed a balance between containing the virus spread and lockdown ...

 
I think that the real issue will become the lack of preparation for testing during January / February for many countries whilst it appears Germany was gearing up and as such seem to have managed a balance between containing the virus spread and lockdown ...

Also the lack of QUALITY protective equipment for front line workers.
 
I'm enjoying this discussion and glad it hasn't boiled over like the brexit thread did.

Obviously the strick lockdowns can't go on forever, life and the economy must go on.
But 2-4 months isn't too much to ask in the grand scheme of this.

Money/jobs/opportunities will recover, some lives won't.

I'm sure savy entrepreneurs are already planning for life after lockdown.

I read yesterday that zoom is now worth more than some big airline companies now.
 
We do not know yet if there will be thousands or millions of death MORE than other years with other influenza or corona type of viruses. The vast majority of people dying...would have died anyway in the coming 5 years because of underlying deceases or age.
We do know that the virus spreads so fast that the Intensive Care units all over the world have insufficient beds and personnel. So that's a problem I can see. But then I still hold the opinion the world has overreacted and we can't turn that back now. This will have a huge impact on the world and I truly doubt if that's worth it. It's ok to disagree, I'm not looking to make my point or something like that.
The world cannot keep this up for months to come. It's damaging the world harder than the virus would have.

WTF are you talking about? Where did you get those numbers.
I think you deserve to shut your mouth.
I just turned 65, my wife is 62, both with auto immune illness. And according to you, we should be dead in 5 years, anyway.
What a load of shite.
 
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Me too, but if it works pretty well, than I'll be f***ing mad at my gouvernement who took the decision to shot down and kill everything I love (including my job).

Read the article, mon ami.
The swedish theory is based on SIMULATIONS.
They draw models and their model is "wait and see"
 
I'm enjoying this discussion and glad it hasn't boiled over like the brexit thread did.

Obviously the strick lockdowns can't go on forever, life and the economy must go on.
But 2-4 months isn't too much to ask in the grand scheme of this.

Money/jobs/opportunities will recover, some lives won't.

I'm sure savy entrepreneurs are already planning for life after lockdown.

I read yesterday that zoom is now worth more than some big airline companies now.

Agreed.

Economies will bounce back. They might be different but they will bounce back. Could revolutionise the world as we know it.

True, this pandemic is testing new lows but I think we could see a V in the markets on the rebound.

Ibiza will still be there too. It might be a bit different to what we all know it as, but it'll still be there as such.
 
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