☣ Coronavirus ☣

[BenH]

Here in the real world.....

Open a ward, 2 days later full. Open another ward, 2 days later full. And so on, and so on. Now we have no more wards. The ambulances keep on coming.

At the same time more and more staff are off. Not a great equation.

Try not to not to have an accident, heart attack, get ill and need an ambulance or hospital bed because for the first time ever there might not be one.

This isnt speculation. It's happening now. There has been a 10 hour wait for a level 2 call (suspected heart attack, stroke etc), in London, maximum wait should be 18 minutes. Busiest day ever for ambulances ever in Birmingham, probably will beat that many times the next couple of weeks

Lockdowns are obviously (to most of us) to stop the above happening or becoming even worse. They arent the long term solution, no one thinks they are do they?

But why not lift the lockdown, what could possibly go wrong?

Mate not having a go because you know what I think of what your doing snd hopefully you know I’m not questioning what you are seeing day in and day out! But what do you consider long term? 1 year in almost seems like a longtime to me!

 

[Johnny Vodka]

It's not about what I think or how I value my life.
It's about what we all think, what's normal and common sense.

But if you really want to ask this question then the answer is yes. Young healthy people are worth more than someone at the end of their life.

If two people are drowning....a young person and an old person, who would you safe?

You're (as far as I can tell) talking about people's right to go out clubbing vs actual right to live (as in not die) though.

If citizens need financial assistance to survive and protect their businesses, then that should be granted. If we, as a society, can't do that, then it's time to have another think about how society is structured. America (capitalism in its purest form) is way worse than us on this.. That's the clue.

 

[William2021]

Skynews is saying - "Holidays to Spain could be delayed until end of summer. The Spanish Prime Minister is reported to have said foreign tourists would be welcome once 70% of his country had been vaccinated."

Does this include Ibiza, and will it mean holidays will begin in September at the earliest? My main concern is for the citizens of Ibiza who depend on tourism revenue, I can't see many hotels willing to open their doors at the end of the summer season, and clubs would be out of the question. Is Ibiza 2021 going to begin in Autumn? Got to stay positive. Health and safety should be everyone's top priority at the moment.

 

[feynman]

Look at China ?

The extreme measures in China are working definitely. Less covid cases than in the most other countries.Look what they did in Hong Kong. But ist it good and sensefull for the western countries ?

 

[Johnny Vodka]

Skynews is saying - "Holidays to Spain could be delayed until end of summer. The Spanish Prime Minister is reported to have said foreign tourists would be welcome once 70% of his country had been vaccinated."

Does this include Ibiza, and will it mean holidays to Ibiza will begin in September at the earliest? I can't see many hotels willing to open their doors at the end of the summer season, and clubs would be out of the question. Is Ibiza 2021 a party or a dream? Got to stay positive. My main concern is for the citizens of Ibiza who depend on tourism revenue. We can still look forward to Summer 2022 which will look a world away from Summer 2019.

I would say September - October for foreign travel if we're lucky. I certainly wouldn't assume it. *speaking as someone in their mid-40s who won't get the vaccine for ages

 

[JayDR8]

common sense

You lost me at this point. You couldn't possibly relate.

 

[cunninghamali]

Skynews is saying - "Holidays to Spain could be delayed until end of summer. The Spanish Prime Minister is reported to have said foreign tourists would be welcome once 70% of his country had been vaccinated."

Does this include Ibiza, and will it mean holidays will begin in September at the earliest? My main concern is for the citizens of Ibiza who depend on tourism revenue, I can't see many hotels willing to open their doors at the end of the summer season, and clubs would be out of the question. Is Ibiza 2021 going to begin in Autumn? Got to stay positive. Health and safety should be everyone's top priority at the moment.

It's not True, Sanchez has said wants to start tourism as soon as posisble

 

[feynman]

I would say September - October for foreign travel if we're lucky. I certainly wouldn't assume it. *speaking as someone in their mid-40s who won't get the vaccine for ages

would be welcome ...

What does it mean ? Tourism not allowed ?
Less tozrists than 2020 ? Cannot believe it
Waiting for a exact , official statement of the gouvernent.

 

[Johnny Vodka]

would be welcome ...

What does it mean ? Tourism not allowed ?
Less tozrists than 2020 ? Cannot believe it
Waiting for a exact , official statement of the gouvernent.

I'm from the UK and thinking more about getting out of and back into the UK than anything the Spanish are doing.

 

[Hally]

Young person and old person are drowning. Young person is a benefits bum who deals a mean line of charlie on the side. Old person in David Attenborough. Who would you save ?

Young person in that scenario, he night be grateful ?

 

[Hally]

Mate not having a go because you know what I think of what your doing snd hopefully you know I’m not questioning what you are seeing day in and day out! But what do you consider long term? 1 year in almost seems like a longtime to me!

We haven't been in lockdown for a year. Social restrictions have been necessary once we let it get hold sadly

Thanks for the kind words

 

[William2021]

It's not True, Sanchez has said wants to start tourism as soon as posisble

Perhaps he was giving a kind of best to worst case scenario when he made that statement? Full article here:

Sky News - Holidays to Spain could be delayed until end of summer

 

[cunninghamali]

Perhaps he was giving a kind of best to worst case scenario when he made that statement? Full article here:

Sky News - Holidays to Spain could be delayed until end of summer

Spain refutes reports that holidaymakers will be unable to visit this summer

Spain's tourism minister has said the country wants to "reactivate tourism" as soon as possible, clarifying reports that it may not full reopen to holidaymakers until after summer.

www.telegraph.co.uk

The press are so annoying

 

[Hally]

?

 

[Springal]

They can’t get it right though can they! Doing half a job against manufacturers instruction. Why were they they not prepping for the roll out during the past 12 months with centres set up ready to go etc! Instead they blew billions on their mates business interests! This is why folk like me who believe how bad it all is are questioning how to proceed!

to be fair the vaccine roll out is going very well. It’s the production levels of the vaccine that can’t supply enough.

with the Pfizer thing, their testing / data was against the booster at 3 weeks. The U.K.are doing this at 12 because their view is they can get many more people the first jab if they don’t do the booster until 12 weeks. So better chance of opening things up again if we have more people vaccinated.

I know the U.K. doctors union think 12 weeks is to long and want 6 weeks, but with your viewpoint on this I thought you would want a program that gets round everyone as quickly as possible

 

[MrHullMysterious]

to be fair the vaccine roll out is going very well. It’s the production levels of the vaccine that can’t supply enough.

with the Pfizer thing, their testing / data was against the booster at 3 weeks. The U.K.are doing this at 12 because their view is they can get many more people the first jab if they don’t do the booster until 12 weeks. So better chance of opening things up again if we have more people vaccinated.

I know the U.K. doctors union think 12 weeks is to long and want 6 weeks, but with your viewpoint on this I thought you would want a program that gets round everyone as quickly as possible

Should point out they only want max 12 weeks reducing to max 6 for Pfizer one due to manufacture data (they didn't do any trials with longer gap than 3 weeks as you said iirc).

For the oxford one, they ain't asking it to be shortened, because even though the manufacture said 3 weeks, their trial data actually shows a longer gap of 8+ weeks made it more effective! (~90%+ as opposed to ~60%+)

Pfizer are also having manufacturing problems due to currently restructuring their facilities to be able to produce 2 billion doses this year compared to the original 1.2b, but are having down time right now.

Italy are on about suing them as they are not going to get the doses promised! Think UK more weighted to oxford one which should have less capacity issues in theory ?‍

 

[lee111s]

Should point out they only want max 12 weeks reducing to max 6 for Pfizer one due to manufacture data (they didn't do any trials with longer gap than 3 weeks as you said iirc).

For the oxford one, they ain't asking it to be shortened, because even though the manufacture said 3 weeks, their trial data actually shows a longer gap of 8+ weeks made it more effective! (~90%+ as opposed to ~60%+)

Pfizer are also having manufacturing problems due to currently restructuring their facilities to be able to produce 2 billion doses this year compared to the original 1.2b, but are having down time right now.

Italy are on about suing them as they are not going to get the doses promised! Think UK more weighted to oxford one which should have less capacity issues in theory ?‍

AZ have reduced the first EU shipments from 80m down to 31m doses due to manufacturining issues

I believe they have had considerably lower yield than expected from the biological process in one of their partner factories.

AZ have said the doses destined for the UK are made elsewhere and unaffected.

 

[MrHullMysterious]

AZ have reduced the first EU shipments from 80m down to 31m doses due to manufacturining issues

I believe they have had considerably lower yield than expected from the biological process in one of their partner factories.

AZ have said the doses destined for the UK are made elsewhere and unaffected.

Yeah just seen that on news now!
Shows how tight things are.

 

[FlatErik]

It's not about what I think or how I value my life.
It's about what we all think, what's normal and common sense.

But if you really want to ask this question then the answer is yes. Young healthy people are worth more than someone at the end of their life.

If two people are drowning....a young person and an old person, who would you safe?

Let me rephrase my reply for all the emotional people on here...

I was asked this:

Do you think someone at the end of their life with a very progressed dementia has less value than you? That is the impression you give but I may be wrong

I said it was not about my life, but if you all would use common sense you would all value a young healthy life more than someone at the end of their life with progressed dementia. Now you can all try virtue signaling here and use your grandma's as example...but we were not talking about your grandma's and grandpa's. We were talking about a random someone at the end of their life vs you/me/anyone young and healthy.

You are dragging this into your personal emotional situations way too far people...

 

[MrHullMysterious]

Let me rephrase my reply for all the emotional people on here...

I was asked this:


I said it was not about my life, but if you all would use common sense you would all value a young healthy life more than someone at the end of their life with progressed dementia. Now you can all try virtue signaling here and use your grandma's as example...but we were not talking about your grandma's and grandpa's. We were talking about a random someone at the end of their life vs you/me/anyone young and healthy.

You are dragging this into your personal emotional situations way too far people...

• Changing the meaning of what you said to now reflect and incredibly small percentage of those dying✔
• Bullshit bingo words and phrases ✔
• Completely missing the points about society and that ✔