☣ Coronavirus ☣

[Hurr1cane]

My girlfriends step dads dad was 72. He was given weeks to live by the docs for prostate cancer, he picked up Covid whilst in hospital yet his death has been registered as Covid. He would of died anyway because of the cancer, so to me this is where it is inaccurate.

From your wording though, he died of COVID-19 before the prostate cancer. Counting his death as due to COVID-19 is correct.

There are going to be edge cases, and when there are hundreds of thousands dead, even 1% of them being edge cases is bound to result in numbers in the thousands. But the newest analysis we have contradicts the notion that most of those dying were already going to die.

Death from COVID-19 results in over ten years of life lost per person, Scottish researchers say

Death from the coronavirus will result in over ten years of life lost per person, according to new research from a Scottish university.

www.heraldscotland.com

From the article:
“This new analysis found that death from Covid-19 results in over ten years of life lost per person, even after taking account of the typical number and type of chronic conditions found in people dying of Covid-19. "

 

[Nostalgic]

Im not overlooking that. The percentage of people under 65 putting that pressure on the IC capacity (in the Netherlands but this probably accounts for all countries) is also too low to justify lockdowns for everyone.

UK have built hospitals for this just incase hospitals and ICU get overun and not all have been used. This was during our peak when they were built aswell, as we are past the peak I would say we would be able to cope

 

[Johnny Vodka]

My Maths: Let's round deaths up to 35,000. We know 10% of deaths are for working age people (18-65 yr olds), and c80% of them have underlying illnesses. So as it stands, out of a population of c.70 Million, 700 working age people with no health conditions have died.

700 is actually more than all of the corona deaths in Greece, way more actually. Also, imagine what we'd be doing as a country if 700 people died in a terrorist attack or something. The same people trying to play this down and trying to force people back to work would be playing a very different tune.

 

[Nostalgic]

From your wording though, he died of COVID-19 before the prostate cancer. Counting his death as due to COVID-19 is correct.

There are going to be edge cases, and when there are hundreds of thousands dead, even 1% of them being edge cases is bound to result in numbers in the thousands. But the newest analysis we have contradicts the notion that most of those dying were already going to die.

Death from COVID-19 results in over ten years of life lost per person, Scottish researchers say

Death from the coronavirus will result in over ten years of life lost per person, according to new research from a Scottish university.

www.heraldscotland.com

From the article:
“This new analysis found that death from Covid-19 results in over ten years of life lost per person, even after taking account of the typical number and type of chronic conditions found in people dying of Covid-19. "

The covid didn't kill him the cancer did. As all the signs were there, its just that he had to be on oxygen for his breathing to make him comfortable. The Covid restricted his breathing. But he was hours from death anyway.

Cigarettes & alcohol also cause shortage of life yet they are still being sold.

I'm not saying it isn't dangerous, but there are worse things out there to worry about aswell as, if not more than Covid.

 

[mr_why]

700 is actually more than all of the corona deaths in Greece, way more actually. Also, imagine what we'd be doing as a country if 700 people died in a terrorist attack or something. The same people trying to play this down and trying to force people back to work would be playing a very different tune.

I do get where you coming from mate, I really do. We are just going to have to open up the debate more if we are ever to get out of this and have ANY Economy to come back to. A Vaccine may NEVER be found. That actually is a possibility.

 

[Hurr1cane]

I do get where you coming from mate, I really do. We are just going to have to open up the debate more if we are ever to get out of this and have ANY Economy to come back to. A Vaccine may NEVER be found. That actually is a possibility.

Feel free to get us started... What are you proposing? What are the risks of your proposal, and how will you know if it is working as intended?

Forgive me if I seem dubious, but I live under a president who undermines state governments lockdown orders almost daily with nothing more than "but the economy..." without ever actually proposing any viable alternative.

The bottom line is, how much death are you willing to accept? I promise I'm not trying to trap anyone just to critique your morals, with the "no death is acceptable" response. I believe there is an economic value we can place on human life, and I don't believe all human life is inherently equal (if its me vs Bill Gates for the last ventilator, give it to him), so I am open to debating the trade offs.

Nobody wants lock downs. Nobody benefits. Not government, citizens, the economy. All of the incentive is to re-open society in a safe manner, yet here we are... it makes me believe its not lack of openness to debate, but that there is no viable alternative to debate.

 

[cunninghamali]

I do get where you coming from mate, I really do. We are just going to have to open up the debate more if we are ever to get out of this and have ANY Economy to come back to. A Vaccine may NEVER be found. That actually is a possibility.

I am sure they will find a vaccine...they found one for all the other viruses.

I am pessimistic about all this virus situation but scientists finding a vaccine is the one thing keeping me going...

 

[craig72]

Why not..

 

[mr_why]

I am sure they will find a vaccine...they found one for all the other viruses.

I am pessimistic about all this virus situation but scientists finding a vaccine is the one thing keeping me going...

HIV still has no Vaccine, society can just control through medication (which took 10+ years to perfect). I am not being negative, but this idea that we should stay at home until the Vaccine arrives - I do not think that is possible

 

[metropolis]

HIV still has no Vaccine

Exactly, and by the way... even for the " normal " flu, there's only one vaccine available at any given time with last year's strain

 

[metropolis]

Exactly, and by the way... even for the " normal " flu, there's only one vaccine available at any given time with last year's strain

......but no problem concerning parties there is a solution !

 

[MrHullMysterious]

Exactly, and by the way... even for the " normal " flu, there's only one vaccine available at any given time with last year's strain

Yeah but the vaccine is for multiple strains combined.

Flu vaccine

Find out about the flu vaccine for adults, including who should have it, how to get it and side effects.

www.nhs.uk

"...Flu vaccines protect against 3 or 4 types of flu virus (usually 2 A types and 1 or 2 B types). Vaccine manufacturers produce flu vaccines based on WHO's recommendations."

Also on HIV, while true no vaccine, you're not likely to catch it stood in a queue at a bar like a respiratory disease ? (force of transmission etc)

 

[lee111s]

There’s still no SARS vaccine after 18 years according to a snippet on the BBC today.

 

[SeoulSaint]

HIV still has no Vaccine, society can just control through medication (which took 10+ years to perfect). I am not being negative, but this idea that we should stay at home until the Vaccine arrives - I do not think that is possible

HIV is far more complex than Covid. It’s really comparing Apple and oranges.

 

[JayDR8]

There’s still no SARS vaccine after 18 years according to a snippet on the BBC today.

There are lots of viruses that don't have vaccines, because if the virus isn't really a danger anymore they don't need to throw money and time at creating one

 

[2H76]

Why not..
View attachment 8991

You little sod. I'm cutting down to beer once every two days, and now you've gone and made me all thirsty. Today's the odd day - no booze.

 

[Hally]

Classing every other death as Coronavirus doesnt help either.

Heart attack>coronavirus
Cancer>coronavirus
Broken leg>coronavirus

Anybody got an idea of the numbers purely through Covid and not underlying health conditions?

Alot of the panic is also influenced by the media.

As for the speech last night it seems Boris has said one thing yet the cabinet are saying another.

The deaths are underplayed if anything sadly

 

[Hally]

I think people are being lulled into a false sense of security by how effective the lockdown has been so far. The first wave was really bad, without a lockdown it would have gotten exponentially worse.

We need to be really careful moving forward

 

[andrewthemod_1978]

on a lighter note, found this pretty amusing

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=706379593440825

 

[Nostalgic]

I think people are being lulled into a false sense of security by how effective the lockdown has been so far. The first wave was really bad, without a lockdown it would have gotten exponentially worse.

We need to be really careful moving forward

So what would you of done?

I was actually in favour yesterday of another 3 weeks of restrictions after seeing that copper getting terrorised on the park yesterday by those chavs. But then I thought, why should the people who have been doing whats asked lose out?

I feel for the high risk people they are stuck indoors hoping idiots like them don't play up and ruin it for everyone else.