Madonna

R

Robder

Active Member
Not a fan of pop here but happy to tap my feet and smile along to the odd guilty pleasure.

Her new album = surface pansy pop with dubstep bandwagon ditties/vacuous lyrics...but love her or hate her, the woman still manages to stay on the cusp of what's culturally acceptable.

Can you imagine if this was released in the late 80s or during the Leah Betts era?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arN3FcUVBuw

It's not even clever and subtle - it's brash and blatant. She's packaged up dance music for a commercial audience (including middle America and Tunbridge Wells) plugging illegal substances or more specifically MDMA ("that's ok").

But what's more interesting is the public's reaction (or non-reaction). I've not heard of a single outraged spokesperson calling for it to be banned.

Definitely a sign of our changing times.
 
Robder said:
Not a fan of pop here but happy to tap my feet and smile along to the odd guilty pleasure.

Her new album = surface pansy pop with dubstep bandwagon ditties/vacuous lyrics...but love her or hate her, the woman still manages to stay on the cusp of what's culturally acceptable.

Can you imagine if this was released in the late 80s or during the Leah Betts era?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arN3FcUVBuw

It's not even clever and subtle - it's brash and blatant. She's packaged up dance music for a commercial audience (including middle America and Tunbridge Wells) plugging illegal substances or more specifically MDMA ("that's ok").

But what's more interesting is the public's reaction (or non-reaction). I've not heard of a single outraged spokesperson calling for it to be banned.

Definitely a sign of our changing times.
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And it's a good things there isn't outrage. We are a liberal nation at heart and all the better for it. Besides the track you posted is hardly on a level with say NWA 'F Tha Police' is it?
 
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How many people even get the reference, though?

And there are 3 ways to interpret the title.

If times were changing, David Nutt wouldn't have been sacked for going against government opinion on MDMA and other drugs - and that seems vastly more important than an over the hill pop star trying to court controversy. My bets are that she'll be crying into her weetabix over no-one seeming bothered... ;) Sadly, (to misquote another over the hill pop star), the times they aren't a changin'.

Anyone remember Ebeneezer Good? Bit controversial, but still got played on radio 1, etc (IIRC).
 
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Deadmau5 :rolleyes:

(hides 1st Deadmau5 album :lol:)

'EDM' :lol: Who the frig calls it that appart from the men in suits?

You can't really separate the evolution of dance music in the last 25 years from drugs (specifically MDMA).
 
Johnny Vodka said:
Anyone remember Ebeneezer Good? Bit controversial, but still got played on radio 1, etc (IIRC).
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That was so wonderfully British, intelligent and suggested.

This isn't...it's brash, American and literal. There is no other way to interpret these lyrics:

Now that your name
Pumps like the blood in my veins
Pulse through my body, igniting my mind
It's like MDMA and that's OK
Feels like a drug
And I can't get enough

Also - with reference to 'over the hill' - that's entirely subjective and relates to your own personal thoughts of what's acceptable for a 53 year old.

Apparently this album has gone to the number 1 spot in 40 countries. This makes her undeniably current in the mediocre but highly marketable world of popular culture.

Lastly, to address 'mashednlovingit's point, Red Dragon's 'Batty Boy Fi Die' was waaaay more controversial than this but to make a direct comparison is ridiculous. Similarly, NWA's 'Fu(k da police' wasn't a commercial release, it was an underground hip hop record.

...

I think, (debates on cr*p pop music and ageism aside) this album represents a significant shift in the cultural tide around public attitudes to casual drug use.
 
Where I come from those who brag about doing things really have no idea what they are talking about. Quit your bull Madonna. I can't even remember a time I saw Madonna get papped looking drunk let alone wired off all sorts. There was an article in mixmag 6/7 maybe more years ago in which it stated Madonna had asked a British journalist 'don't you guys do special K yet? lol ahem bullsh....
 
mojito said:
Where I come from those who brag about doing things really have no idea what they are talking about. Quit your bull Madonna. I can't even remember a time I saw Madonna get papped looking drunk let alone wired off all sorts. There was an article in mixmag 6/7 maybe more years ago in which it stated Madonna had asked a British journalist 'don't you guys do special K yet? lol ahem bullsh....
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To be fair, her club credentials are far more impressive than my own.

She was a Paradise Garage regular. End of.
 
mojito said:
Where I come from those who brag about doing things really have no idea what they are talking about. Quit your bull Madonna. I can't even remember a time I saw Madonna get papped looking drunk let alone wired off all sorts. There was an article in mixmag 6/7 maybe more years ago in which it stated Madonna had asked a British journalist 'don't you guys do special K yet? lol ahem bullsh....
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She is doing what she has done very successfully for several decades, selling records. Are you suggesting a musician should not use lyrics if they don't have up to date first hand experience of the subject matter?
 
Robder said:
Also - with reference to 'over the hill' - that's entirely subjective and relates to your own personal thoughts of what's acceptable for a 53 year old.
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Lets face it, it's been a while since Madonna has made anything WORTH listening to. She now just sounds like an oldie, latching on to the latest trend/producer. Nothing to do with ageism, more just that she's run out of ideas and fails to stand out from the Gagas and Perrys.

Robder said:
I think, (debates on cr*p pop music and ageism aside) this album represents a significant shift in the cultural tide around public attitudes to casual drug use.
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I really don't sense that casual drug use has become any more acceptable. If it has, it's certainly not reflected in politics and law-making, which is where it matters. Ecstasy/MDMA is still considered a threat on the level of cocaine, heroin and crystal meth, by the drug classification system and probably to most people who've never tried it. (And, of course, to those who have tried it, it's not particularly edgy and just feels like part of the landscape.)

Madge's response of 'From one mouse to another, I don't support drug use and I never have' to Deadmau5's comments just sounds cowardly - less willing to put her metaphorical balls on the line than an ex government science but still hoping to gain from the controversy. Sad.
 
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I'm with Rob on this one, we have moved on. Madonna and I are in the same age range and she was a dancer on the NYC scene in the early 80's. Everyone changes from a minging youth to an adult who can handle it as they get older.
 
Johnny Vodka said:
Lets face it, it's been a while since Madonna has made anything WORTH listening to. She now just sounds like an oldie, latching on to the latest trend/producer. Nothing to do with ageism, more just that she's run out of ideas and fails to stand out from the Gagas and Perrys.
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It's pop. This isn't a debate about a genre I have no interest in.

Your comments don't stand up against the £££.

I really don't sense that casual drug use has become any more acceptable
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I think it has.
 
Robder said:
It's pop. This isn't a debate about a genre I have no interest in.

Your comments don't stand up against the £££.
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She's at number 1 this week, to be replaced by a new poppet within a month, if not next week. You can't seriously argue she's the dominant female performer she once was?
 
Robder said:
That was so wonderfully British, intelligent and suggested.

This isn't...it's brash, American and literal. There is no other way to interpret these lyrics:

Now that your name
Pumps like the blood in my veins
Pulse through my body, igniting my mind
It's like MDMA and that's OK
Feels like a drug
And I can't get enough

Also - with reference to 'over the hill' - that's entirely subjective and relates to your own personal thoughts of what's acceptable for a 53 year old.

Apparently this album has gone to the number 1 spot in 40 countries. This makes her undeniably current in the mediocre but highly marketable world of popular culture.

Lastly, to address 'mashednlovingit's point, Red Dragon's 'Batty Boy Fi Die' was waaaay more controversial than this but to make a direct comparison is ridiculous. Similarly, NWA's 'Fu(k da police' wasn't a commercial release, it was an underground hip hop record.

...

I think, (debates on cr*p pop music and ageism aside) this album represents a significant shift in the cultural tide around public attitudes to casual drug use.
Click to expand...

Robder - give it a rest, everyone was playing that track when it came out on Straight Outa Compton which was a commercial release! How do you know the track referred to above will be released commercially? And I could make an endless list of more controversial commercial tracks.

How about the White Lines by Grandmaster Flash? And please don't tell me about the (don't do it) bit.
 
WeLuvIbiza said:
She is doing what she has done very successfully for several decades, selling records. Are you suggesting a musician should not use lyrics if they don't have up to date first hand experience of the subject matter?
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I was referring to her outburst on stage rather than her lyrics. I couldn't care less what her lyrics are as I won't be buying her new album as I don't like her new music or anything to do with Nicki Minaj.
 
mashednlovingit said:
Robder - give it a rest, everyone was playing that track when it came out on Straight Outa Compton which was a commercial release! How do you know the track referred to above will be released commercially? And I could make an endless list of more controversial commercial tracks.

How about the White Lines by Grandmaster Flash? And please don't tell me about the (don't do it) bit.
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My point was a small one - that Madonna is the most famous female on the planet next to Princess Di (dead). She stars on Children in Need and is a contender for Christmas number ones and wedding reception dances.

The hip hop audience is a niche audience pedalled to listeners that expect anarchic themes.

Madonna is about as mainstream as you can possibly go. She makes her money from being canny at the right moments, jumping on producers and creating controversy in subtle ways with big PR machines to deflect/harvest any rebukes (because all publicity is good publicity).

Back in the 90s when Ebineezer Goode was charting, the tabloids went mental.

Now, an iconic figure starts merrily harping on about MDMA useage and no one says anything. Not even Vanessa Feltz on her morning chat show, parent campaiging groups or Mary Whitehouse figures.

No one is talking about it.

The lack of media storm is conspicuous by its absence.
 
Robder said:
The lack of media storm is conspicuous by its absence.
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Because not many people beyond clubbers know what it is or associate it with 'ecstasy'.

I think the whole David Nutt controversy shows the majority of Brits aren't cool with ecstasy/MDMA.

MDNA can also be intepreted as an abbreviation of her name or M-DNA.
 
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