Pope
- Thread starter Robder
- Start date
Red
Active Member
Olly and Robder are spot on with this.
But, just to add:
Zeitgeist (Part 1) The Greatest Story Ever Told...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNf-P_5u_Hw&feature=relatedhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=iv&v=6pgRUpDDrb0&annotation_id=annotation_994351
But, just to add:
Zeitgeist (Part 1) The Greatest Story Ever Told...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNf-P_5u_Hw&feature=relatedhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=iv&v=6pgRUpDDrb0&annotation_id=annotation_994351
Nice try.
I've never had a disturbing encounter with a rapist, does that mean I have no right to despise them?
It's too much like hard work...you've just highlighted my point. Of course it's ok to despise the fvcking screw heads...jesus, I can't be arsed with you lot, my point stays.
"You must have had a disturbing personal encounter with Catholisism...I am very sorry for you if that's the case.
Because if you didn't - your apparent hatred for the religion is based on the DaVinci Code and the BBC, well...enough said really."
Your point seems to be that unless he's had first hand problems with the catholic church, he's ignorant. Which is Ironic, considering what you're arguing.
Because if you didn't - your apparent hatred for the religion is based on the DaVinci Code and the BBC, well...enough said really."
Your point seems to be that unless he's had first hand problems with the catholic church, he's ignorant. Which is Ironic, considering what you're arguing.
IMO religion has been used to control the masses, gain wealth, and commit ethnic cleansing (ie the conversion of African, south american, and North american native people) Nothing is absolute but religion has had a hand in many deaths. Organized religion has also stood on the sideline as people were oppressed/abused (ie women, children, and slavery). A moral compass is just that; if you don't have morality you can be a sheep in wolves clothing.
They are expressing their viewpoint.......dosent mean they are spot on.
The Catholic church does have a lot of problems to sort out at the moment......but so does liverpool FC. Its easy to criticise something when life is not going well for said establishment.
imo the catholic church in a REFORMED state, still has a lot to offer society and the world. Not everybody is educated and for people living in third world countries, the catholic church teaches, cares and feeds millions of people. The missions that go back centuries have contributed much to devloping worlds (you can argue that they didnt ask for it) but it brought education and learning, which is vital for a person to make decisions for themselves.
There is a liberal movement in the Catholic church that wants change. More involvement of the laity, women priests, reforms of ideology (contraception and Gay rights included) and a more compassionate modern church. But they are not powerful enough to take on the present administration.
The present pope is head of a fundamental, right wing, conservative society within the Vatican that is resisting this reform for the past 30years. Before he was pope he was the acting CEO of the Roman Curia, the executive administrative body, similar to the Home Civil Service. It is the police of the Vatican.
They rule with an iron fist and are associated with Opus Dei another powerful and influential body with the church. Until this traditional sect dies out, the Catholic church will continue in decline as they are so out of touch with modern society.
The Catholic church is not perfect, but I dont think we have to throw the baby out with the bathwater. There are enough good parts to benefit society and as religions go, its not the worst of them.
But practices from the Catholic church were ripped from ancient traditions and bastardised for their own purpose. The male was exalted (as a means to control) and the female, shamed.
The resulting crusades killed millions and ripped out the hearts of indigenous cultures through genocide by any bloodthirsty means possible.
This is pure fact - not speculation so please don't just brush over it.
I'm being an optimist - I actually think basic human compassion is possible without the need for a conduit or doctrine.
Anyone is free to sing the praises of Catholicism if they wish but the above to me is an integral part of the story that cannot be ignored.
It's the biggest conspiracy theory of our time...and it's not even that hidden - it's right under our noses.
(AND I've not even mentioned the recent Nazism quotes, holocaust/condom deniers which have cased overpopulation and the spread of HIV...oh and child abuse.)
The resulting crusades killed millions and ripped out the hearts of indigenous cultures through genocide by any bloodthirsty means possible.
This is pure fact - not speculation so please don't just brush over it.
I'm being an optimist - I actually think basic human compassion is possible without the need for a conduit or doctrine.
Anyone is free to sing the praises of Catholicism if they wish but the above to me is an integral part of the story that cannot be ignored.
It's the biggest conspiracy theory of our time...and it's not even that hidden - it's right under our noses.
(AND I've not even mentioned the recent Nazism quotes, holocaust/condom deniers which have cased overpopulation and the spread of HIV...oh and child abuse.)
Of course you are right........you cant ignore it. But the past is the past its done its over, Nothing we can do about it now. No use crying over split milk and all that. They occurred in different parameters and conditions not related to todays society. Life back then was about survival of the fittest.
If people hang about dwelling on things or over analysing them then, they never move forward.
In the words of Jim Morrison "The time to hesitate is through No time to wallow in the mire Try now we can only lose And our love become a funeral pyre"
Nothing we can do except see these new fangled man made teachings of the last 2000 odd years for what they are - an utter sham. If we don't learn from this then technically the past isn't over - we're still living it.
...unless you actually believe that there's a God bloke in the sky (not a woman mind) who is completely separate from any human and will fu(k you over if you don't obey his scriptures.
Better not commit sodom then.
...unless you actually believe that there's a God bloke in the sky (not a woman mind) who is completely separate from any human and will fu(k you over if you don't obey his scriptures.
Better not commit sodom then.
Red
Active Member
For the love of god, can't we just give them EDUCATION? Why does it have to be wrapped up in fairy stories? The world itself is an amazing and "miraculous" place withoutthe need to make anything up.
But they aren't making their own decision are they? They are making decisions based on the religious views they have been taught, not on logic or the all important evidence.
I agree with some of the rest of what you say, up until this point:
Society should educate to the point where individuals don't NEED religion to be good people.
Agree strongly.
If we are to benefit the children of this world all we need to do is hold a quality space, almost becoming invisible, so that they feel able to find their own maps and develop their own search for truth.
This is the greatest possible gift we can give to anyone but instead our culture seems to propagate the mission of carrying ancestral sh!t from generations before and dumping it on children to indoctrinate them into a cult that tells them they can't have any sense of freedom...worse still, that sex is something 'functional' and must NOT be enjoyed under any circumstances.
Population explosions, the spread of HIV, lack of puberty rites, teenage pregnancies etc are all directly related to this. Catholic schools = good one.
So I guess we all agree? Or do any creationist fruit-loops care to challenge with God as their witness?
I am the last person that wants to defend any religion. I dont want to defend it. Certain things happen for a reason, its like lifes cycle......take it as Karma if you want.
Whats happening to the Catholic church now is the beginning of the end for it as an institution/religion/movement what ever you want to call it.
You reap what you sew.
What I am trying to say is that the genuine people that are part of it can forgive its past and start again. Without people you would have no religion.
Of course any argument is going to sound Paradoxical to the person who has a different viewpoint as you draw the conclusions needed to support your viewpoint.
Scientology is a religion not based on history, and there are a few more.
We could debate this all day but it fundamentally boils down to an individuals viewpoint. It is up to each person to live with the ideology they feel comfortable with.
Im just trying to explain the reasons for my own personal viewpoint on the matter without prejudice of anybodys elses viewpoint.
I know - you're being put thorough the mill a bit ain't ya?
But... (I'm afraid there is a but)
bez said:
The religion bastardised ancient earth practices in order to build a brand - this is fact, not speculation or a mere viewpoint.
bez said:
Yeah fine - decent people are into God and stuff, granted...but start again as what? 'reformed Christians'?
If this is the case, then I reserve the right to be as lairy as possible about it. People need to have the true history of events rammed down their throat until they stop aligning themselves with this $hit...(because that's categorically what it is)
...
and sorry to be directing all this at you babber.
I don't spend every moment of my waking life ranting about Catholics (just by the way).
But naah - I don't intend to shut up about it either.
People have literally spent years not speaking out about this stuff with severe consequences. If the pope could put us back there he would.
But naah - I don't intend to shut up about it either.
People have literally spent years not speaking out about this stuff with severe consequences. If the pope could put us back there he would.
So if some bigoted twat is telling you that you're going to hell because of your sexual preference, despite that being the way you're born (It's not a ****ing lifestyle choice) you'd just ignore it and go about your day?
Seems to me you need to grow a backbone... Which is a shame, considering the frock wearing overlords view on stem cell research.
If I were gay, and some religious twat told me I was going to hell, I would disconnect their head from their neck. Homophobes are no better than racists, and 'just ignoring it' is a pathetic stance to take.