lee111s
Well-Known Member
I hope ours doesn’t either.
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I hope ours doesn’t either.
FlatErik
Well-Known Member
My point is...there are not many other measures left to use in the restriction-toolkit.
Also, the government (and lots of people here) keep claiming lockdowns work, facemasks work, curfews work. With a mutation that is not more lethal, but more contagious...there should be no difference then. The measures should work so even if this variant is more contagious...the measures to stop that are already in place and at it's highest level ever in the entire EU.
Perhaps I should have stressed that it's the Dutch media and our politicians that are talking about 'horrible images from the UK', the terrifying new strain from the UK...etc. I've heard doctors and virologists talking with the right kind of nuance about the new strains, but the media and politicians neglect that and need it as fearporn. The "UK variant" is now THE keyword to keep already existing measures in place and keep the crowd scared and pliable.
If you think the current restrictions aren't enough...we might need to admit that we can't control everything that happens in life with lockdowns and closing everything up. If you feel restrictions should be even stricter...I can't even think of what inhumane actions governments need to think of to be even stricter right now.
FlatErik
Well-Known Member
Me neither, but I'm also realistic. We cannot control or prevent everything that happens in life by keeping people locked up indefinitely.
I can relate to people having to lose relatives because of this virus, that's terrible off course.... but I can also relate to people that are now depressed or even suicidal because of their dying business.
Browny
Well-Known Member
UK coronavirus deaths pass 100,000 after 1,564 reported in one day
Experts condemn ‘phenomenal failure of policy and practice’ in handling of pandemic
You’re not realistic at all and have never been about COVID. All along you said there would be no ‘wonder vaccines’, because we haven’t cured flu etc. So you’re wrong there.
you are also wrong by saying masks and lockdowns ‘don’t work’ - what does that mean? Do you honestly believe there would be no additional deaths if we didn’t have lockdowns or people didn’t wear masks?
lastly - how many additional suicides have there been compared to ‘normal’ vs additional deaths because of COVID? Yes there are issues but mental health is not a greater issues or cause for loss of life over COVID.
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BenH
Active Member
I heard they are now changing it to anyone that died following a test within 60 days! Don’t no if it’s true or for what reason they might do that, it seems strange to make a change like that!
Nothing surprises me anymore, I’m usually quite optimistic in general but I’m losing hope atm!
Has anyone else heard this? It’s something my wife mentioned earlier!
ive pretty much stopped watching the news, I have abandoned social media too. This is the only place I really see anything Covid related right now.
Nothing surprises me anymore, I’m usually quite optimistic in general but I’m losing hope atm!
Has anyone else heard this? It’s something my wife mentioned earlier!
ive pretty much stopped watching the news, I have abandoned social media too. This is the only place I really see anything Covid related right now.
Johnny Vodka
Well-Known Member
So stop the lockdowns... and, for starters, how would you deal with the pressure on health services?
Hally
Well-Known Member
More contagious measures less effective, it's a numbers game
Fearporn or letting people know what is happening so they can change behaviour
What would be inhumane would be not acting and causing more needless deaths. The hospitals are carnage with these restrictions, without would be a lot lot worse
You do realise there is a vaccine and an endpoint to this?
In autumn there wasnt even a problem it was all false positives if I recall. Struggling to get you
djedwardsmith
Active Member
I can't believe I'm about to waste my time on this because none of it will sink in but f*** it, why not.
Right, there's two problems here. The first one is that you're not being clear about what you mean when you say "lockdowns work". Work in what way? Everyone in here has repeatedly told you that they are intended to supress transmission, and in turn to reduce pressure on hospitals. And in that respect, the data is categorical evidence that they do work.
Onto the second point - even if we take your logic at face value, the restrictions that have been put in place around face masks, social distancing etc...have all been done based on the initial understanding of the transmissibility of the virus - if this has now increased due to the mutation, it's only natural to re-evaluate our efforts to supress it and make sure they're adequate. There are many, many more things the government can do, many of which Scotland rolled out today so I expect us to follow suit shortly.
I don't understand how you can look at how the virus has grown exponentially in the UK since mid-December, and the number of deaths that keeps rising, and think the only reason your politicians are trying to warn of the dangers of it because they want to keep people scared. How about they don't want people to die in large numbers?
Restrictions could easily be stricter - and should be. No click and collect, no takeaway coffee's, curfews, close construction sites, close all schools. All are options that can be done, that worked in March, and would drastically reduce the transmission rate. None are nice, none are things any of us actively want to see if it can be avoided. But what's the alternative? Going down your previous logic of "Eh, they'd have been dead soon anyway?".
Right, there's two problems here. The first one is that you're not being clear about what you mean when you say "lockdowns work". Work in what way? Everyone in here has repeatedly told you that they are intended to supress transmission, and in turn to reduce pressure on hospitals. And in that respect, the data is categorical evidence that they do work.
Onto the second point - even if we take your logic at face value, the restrictions that have been put in place around face masks, social distancing etc...have all been done based on the initial understanding of the transmissibility of the virus - if this has now increased due to the mutation, it's only natural to re-evaluate our efforts to supress it and make sure they're adequate. There are many, many more things the government can do, many of which Scotland rolled out today so I expect us to follow suit shortly.
I don't understand how you can look at how the virus has grown exponentially in the UK since mid-December, and the number of deaths that keeps rising, and think the only reason your politicians are trying to warn of the dangers of it because they want to keep people scared. How about they don't want people to die in large numbers?
Restrictions could easily be stricter - and should be. No click and collect, no takeaway coffee's, curfews, close construction sites, close all schools. All are options that can be done, that worked in March, and would drastically reduce the transmission rate. None are nice, none are things any of us actively want to see if it can be avoided. But what's the alternative? Going down your previous logic of "Eh, they'd have been dead soon anyway?".
Hally
Well-Known Member
Not indefinite though is it?
lee111s
Well-Known Member
Yeah grim indeed, we’re at about 800 per day on the 7 day average by date of death, but it’s going to increase in the coming weeks.UK coronavirus deaths pass 100,000 after 1,564 reported in one day
Experts condemn ‘phenomenal failure of policy and practice’ in handling of pandemicwww.theguardian.com
kimajy
Well-Known Member
I can think of a great many !! Checkpoints at the entrance to villages stopping anyone entering or leaving without a permit, and for every street in cities. The whole population living on State designated food parcels brought in by approved couriers appointed for the area, no shoppng for yourself. Nobody outside their houses other than to walk round the block with a dog else stay inside your house or Apartment for 6 weeks. These "lockdowns" are relatively loose and rely entirely on voluntary adherence. The only enforcement is where people congregate, go to high profile popular beauty spots or get reported by neighbours for causing a nuisance. The closest things got to being very restrictive in Europe (barring going shipping) was in the first lockdown in Spain !
Severe lockdowns are ridiculous imo and don’t really make any incremental difference compared to the more standard lockdown rules. Gyms and restaurants with precautions are not contributing to the spread, so not sure what closing them completely accomplishes. Not letting people leave their homes? Crazy.
I’m in Florida now. Bars, restaurants, gyms are fairly wide open. Yeah, cases and deaths are not great, but not much different than other states and countries that have much harsher restrictions. Warm weather helps for sure.
I’m in Florida now. Bars, restaurants, gyms are fairly wide open. Yeah, cases and deaths are not great, but not much different than other states and countries that have much harsher restrictions. Warm weather helps for sure.
LP_IBIZA
Well-Known Member
UK coronavirus deaths pass 100,000 after 1,564 reported in one day
Experts condemn ‘phenomenal failure of policy and practice’ in handling of pandemic
It is a grim time indeed with the death rate that high already in the UK and likely to continue rising due to the 2/3 lag we are now starting to experience due to mixing across Xmas and NYE! ?
However, the only slight positive right now (and it may be a little too early to read into this) is that the positive cases have been down for a few consecutive days now. The deaths do then seem to follow a few weeks later - so although this period right now is incredibly tough and bleak for most I do personally feel strangely positive and do foresee light at the end of the tunnel, particularly with the rate at which the vaccine is being distributed.
My Dad is being vaccinated on Friday as he is a sparky in our local hospital and a frontline worker. My Mum is receiving her confirmed date shortly but will be getting in the next 2/3 weeks as she is a personal carer for someone with severe autism. My Grandad was also given his first jab last weekend.
I'm personally seeing/hearing of a lot of people I know being vaccinated and every single jab is one jab closer to normality and an end to the nightmare and hardship of this pandemic! Fingers crossed the world will be in a totally different place in the coming months ?
BareBen91
Active Member
UK coronavirus deaths pass 100,000 after 1,564 reported in one day
Experts condemn ‘phenomenal failure of policy and practice’ in handling of pandemic
This is how they are distributed by date of death
Hally
Well-Known Member
Sitting in one of the big regional vaccination centres with my mum. Must be 100 people waiting, cant be one under 80. Havent asked them if they would prefer to be dead yet but will if I get the chance
It's not like they are doing anything useful like work, or fun like clubbing. What a waste of good vaccine
It's not like they are doing anything useful like work, or fun like clubbing. What a waste of good vaccine
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lee111s
Well-Known Member
This isn’t true.
On the gov data dashboard there has always been the 28 and 60 day data. All reported data you see in the news is relevant to the 28 day measure and isn’t changing.
The disparity reported by some outlets is using ONS data which are deaths where Covid-19 was a major factor in the death, regardless of how long after a test was taken (and is always a few weeks behind due to the way the collate and publish).
BenH
Active Member
Thanks for clearing that up
eclipse15
Well-Known Member
Wonder who will miss the sarcasm in this post first....
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