demolition of the cretu mansion ! ?

should cretu´s mansion be demolished or not ?

  • yes

    Votes: 2 14.3%
  • no

    Votes: 10 71.4%
  • don´t know

    Votes: 2 14.3%

  • Total voters
    14
  • Poll closed .

Luke C

Active Member
not sure really, can see the whole point on it being demolished if it doesnt comply with the rules as it would set a dangerous precendent on the island...however its one hell of a waste as its a beautiful property.:(
 

blackswan555

Active Member
Just plain daft to knock it down, I can not believe it is the environmentalists that want it knocked down, The cost / waste / environmental damage involved is counter productive to what they are supposed to be about (maybe a little to much time on their hands ?)
I agree it is at the very least a little iffy on the planning, but he has the papers for that, the latest twist is that although he has papers, they are for 1000 ish sqm, It is a min of three times that size, So it has gone all quiet about sueing San Ann for compensation.

My suggestion, A large fine = A cancer/children's/whatever unit built at Can Missis, Mr Cretu to pay for the building of it, Whoever owns the house to pay an ongoing contribution to the running of unit.

Have a good one
Tim

PS I have been to the house, It would be a crime to knock it down.
 
I

icebaer69

Guest
...however its one hell of a waste as its a beautiful property.:(

Just plain daft to knock it down ... It would be a crime to knock it down.
some years ago (ca. 2002) there was a very similar case at the côte d’ azur.
before and after the demolition a lot of people regretted it and said that
something more reasonable should have been done with this villa:

"...
The demand for a piece of Mediterranean or Atlantic coast is so great
that residents are becoming increasingly protective of the views
from their verandahs and developers are more willing to flout the planning laws.

In the latest case ..., a lawyer filed a suit calling for the destruction
of 40 luxury homes in Cap Ferret on the Atlantic, saying that they were all illegal.
Such cases have taken a particularly virulent turn in recent years,
with French justice prepared to enforce the law through demolition orders.
...

The most notorious of these disputes ended ...,
when bulldozers moved in to a £15 million villa built at Cap d’Antibes
by the businessman, Christian Pellerin.

In 1988 the council had granted planning permission for an 80 sq m house,
only to see a 3,000 sq m mansion spring up.

It took 14 years to order demolition of the villa, named l’Islette.
Yet amid the rubble, a mystery remained.
M Pellerin never lived in the villa and never said who it was for.

Inside, on one of the doors was a plaque,
La Chambre du Président (The President’s Bedroom).
According to French journalists, this was evidence that M Pellerin had intended
the mansion for his friend, François Mitterrand.
..."
(http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/article861654.ece)
 

Morbyd

Moderator
A million dollars to knock it down. Best use of taxpayer funds ever!

I'm with Blackswann... a nice fine and let it go.
 

tripehound

New Member
Ah c'mon the ayutamiente allow far worse than that when they grant permission at least its follows a reasonable style, However for soemthing this scale perhaps he shodul have gone for colonial rather than moorish, its just too big -- OR -- put half of it underground. Someone is just upset they didnt get a fat enough envelope or has taken against the particular Hungarian in question. At least part of it must be legit.
 
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icebaer69

Guest
A million dollars to knock it down.
Best use of taxpayer funds ever! ...
"cretu-mansion-demolition-derby-competition"
goes (probably) in the final round:

- 8 demolition-companies took part
- the best offer so far:
one of these companies says that it can demolish the house
within 21 days with a budget of 346,653 euro
(instead of 3 months/900,000 euro)
- now the government has to find out if this company
really can do the job for this money in this time
or if it´s only an unrealistic dumping-offer to get the contract .
(http://www.diariodeibiza.es/seccion...esa-navarra-derribara-casa-Cretu-346650-euros)
 

mr_l_k

No longer active
if you want to have a go at anybody do your research

who gave the licence
and who (which govn) is enforcing the demolition
 

Morbyd

Moderator
Are you trying to say that the decision to pursue demolition is connected to the last change in government? Something related to the involvement of a certain prominent autobahn-loving family?
 

mr_l_k

No longer active
page 30-32 of octobers ibiza now magazine and page 74-75 of decembers edition ;)

however here's a pre se of the story from the october edition (decembers update is online but i fear the wrath of spotlight if i link to it ;) ):

In April 1997 Cretu received a permit from the Sant Antoni municipality and the Island Council commission responsible to build a villa on a hill near Santa Agnès of more than 1,000 square metres. There were a number of controversies surrounding the project even before construction started. For one, Cretu was building on the top of a hill, which isn’t allowed under Spanish law.

Additionally, construction cannot take place above 200 metres in a natural protected area, which is how the area is classified, and the house is built at about 220 metres above sea level. Furthermore, no large buildings for commercial purposes, for example a music studio, are allowed.

The environmental organisation GEN pointed out all of these points to Antonio Marí Tur, the mayor at the time, in writing on a number of occasions. Those responsible not only ignored the complaints, they took it a step further and attempted to rebut the arguments of the environmentalists. One of the strangest counter-arguments coming from the town hall was the claim that the building was not located on the top of a hill, even though everyone could see that it was actually located atop the hill.

Shortly thereafter GEN filed an official complaint with the public prosecutor’s office. In 2001 the highest court in Palma declared the building illegal and stipulated that the area must be returned to its natural state. Cretu and the Sant Antoni municipality both appealed against the decision, which was dismissed in 2002. The highest court confirmed the original decision on a number of occasions and Sant Antoni was called upon to enforce the decision within two months.

Surprisingly, at the end of 2003 theBalearic Islands parliament passed a law, at the request of the Ibicencan Island Council, that only applied on Ibiza and Formentera. It stated that homes in rural areas could be made legal after the fact if they were located at a height of between 200 and 250 metres above sea level. Despite this gambit, the highest court again confirmed the decision for demolition.

Then, in 2006 came the decision of the Ibicencan investigating judge, Juan Carlos Torres, who suggested putting the penal proceedings, including those against former mayor Tur amongst others, on ice. In 2007 GEN and the public prosecutor’s office appealed against this decision and their appeal was upheld by the highest court.

so no, this has been going on for quite awhile ;)
 
I

icebaer69

Guest
"...
Decision Pending

The decision on who will finally win the contract to knock down the Cretu mansion
has been delayed so that some of the companies involved have the chance
to better explain their proposals.

The deputy mayor, Joan Pantaleoni, explained that some of the eight proposals
contained significant reductions, both economic and to the time-scale of the work.
He said the deciding panel had deemed it necessary for the companies to explain
their claims, so as to ensure there were no problems once the contract was awarded.

The Town Hall has put aside a total of €900,000 of next year's budget towards
the demolition, which it estimates will take around three months.

Meanwhile, the environmentalist group, GEN, accused the Town Hall of using
this excuse as a delaying tactic, claiming they were once again
"taking advantage of the infinite patience" of the judge ruling on the case.
..."
(ibiza-sun)
 

Morbyd

Moderator
Not to appear too much on Mr Cretu's side, given that it sounds a lot like he greased some palms to get his permits, but I'd think the residents of Ibiza would be upset more about wasting 900,000 euros of taxpayers' money during an economic downturn than about a house on top of a hill :!:
 

mr_l_k

No longer active
it would be great if ibiza had the choice - it doesnt - we're beholden to palma

thats the problem
 
I

icebaer69

Guest
€ 346,650 / 21 days

"...
Contract Given

The Town Hall of San Antonio has awarded the demolition contract
of the Cretu mansion ... to Erri Berri, a company from Navarra,
for an estimated €346,650, and who will take just 21 days to complete.

Although the budget for the work was set much higher, (€900,000),
Councillor Joan Pantaleoni admitted this had been the cheapest estimate.
The company will now have to complete various administrative procedures
before the contract is finalised.

It is now up to the administration to give the music producer his final notice
to abandon the property.
If he refuses the Town Hall will be forced to seek a court injunction
in order to force him to leave the mansion.

On the same day the court case investigating any possible wrongdoing
into the issuing of the building permit for the mansion was temporarily suspended.
A representative of the GEN environmentalist group, Neus Prats, the member
of the opposition at the time the license was issued, Pep Ribas,
and several others involved in the case were all due to appear before the judge.
If found guilty, both the ex-mayor, Joan Mari Tur, and Michel Cretu
could face criminal charges.

For his part, Cretu's lawyer, Jaume Roig, claimed his client had a total of 2,000 objects
of value which needed to be removed from the property, adding that Cretu
had nowhere to store the items and the responsibility rested with the Town Hall.
..."
(ibiza-sun)
 
I

icebaer69

Guest
"...
Another Delay

Whilst the company in charge of the demolition of the Cretu mansion
claimed it was ready to begin work, the Romanian music producer
presented a list of over 1,000 objects which he claims need to be removed
from the property before the bulldozers move in.

The demolition notice states that anything that can be saved will be.
However, it does so, according to Cretu's lawyer, Jaume Roig,
in "a generic and imprecise way".
He claims all his client wants to do is know from the start
exactly what can be preserved.

Councillor Joan Pantaleoni did not wish to go into too much detail
but claimed the Town Hall's experts were studying the matter,
and that the issue would be resolved in a matter of days.
..."
(ibiza-sun)
 
I

icebaer69

Guest
"...
2vifn5z.jpg



For Sale

Michel Cretu's lawyer confirmed over the weekend that the music producer
had put all of the properties he owns on the island up for sale.

The decision comes as the Town Hall announced work on the demolition
of the property would begin soon.

The properties were bought during the last 20 years, and were not rented
but used by the producer's friends and family whilst visiting the island.
..."
(ibiza-sun)
 
I

icebaer69

Guest
"...
New Ultimatum

The Town Hall in San Antonio has given Michael Cretu 30 days
to clear all of his personal possessions from his mansion
before the bulldozers move in.

The deputy mayor, Joan Pantaleoni, said the decision had been taken
because the alternative would prove even more complicated,
and involve the Town Hall having to clear the house, categorise all of the items,
and then store everything they found inside.
If nothing is removed the Town Hall will understand
that the Romanian music producer does not want any of it,
and continue with the demolition.

Several days later Cretu's lawyer insisted that it was part of the demolition job
to remove what was inside the mansion, adding this meant it was the task
of the Town Hall.
He finished by claiming his client would take the necessary legal action
if anything was destroyed which could be salvaged.
..."
(ibiza-sun)
 
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