BNP pelted with eggs...

matt collins said:
Yes that's true also and either one is better than voting BNP but please don't blame 'apathetic tossers' for letting the BNP in.

The fact we are debating it here and elsewhere - is that not testament to them now being proclaimed as THE protest vote, now even moreso???
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anyone who believes that it is ok to vote for the BNP as a protest vote is as bad as someone who outright supports them.

it's like someone who has racist sentiments but never says or acts in a racist way, it doesn't make them any less complicit in that particular evil.
 
... I have looked everywhere for there proposed manifesto, so far their whole campaign is focused on immigration.
They are only getting votes from the truly ignorant.
Maybe this might make those that didnt bother turning up to the polling station think twice about wasting their vote.
In some countries they would give anything for the freedom to vote... think on....
 
grego said:
anyone who believes that it is ok to vote for the BNP as a protest vote is as bad as someone who outright supports them.

it's like someone who has racist sentiments but never says or acts in a racist way, it doesn't make them any less complicit in that particular evil.
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But it is not anyone elses business how people vote. As far as I'm concerned it is not morally viable to vote for them but it is everyones own right to vote for who they want it's not for me or you to judge them. I personally think that everyone who votes labour is a moron but that is their right.

My point about it being a protest vote is due to the bruhaha we have at the moment about it, I don't think it's right for obvious reasons but it's made more of a fuss than if people had voted green, lib dem, jury, christian or whoever. Thus making it more effective.
 
matt collins said:
But it is not anyone elses business how people vote. As far as I'm concerned it is not morally viable to vote for them but it is everyones own right to vote for who they want it's not for me or you to judge them.
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I always "judge" people who vote for the BNP. And I always judge them as racist or dangerously ignorant.

There is no margin for complacency or compromise, otherwise they will become accepted by default.

This time I didn't feel like voting for anyone, but I voted as I was aware that the BNP could gain through "stay away" voters.

Hatred for the BNP is caused by their racist and divisive politics which divides and ruins communities.

The BNP's hatred is caused because some people dare to have a different skin colour.

So, no, that hatred is not the same thing.
 
matt collins said:
My point about it being a protest vote is due to the bruhaha we have at the moment about it, I don't think it's right for obvious reasons but it's made more of a fuss than if people had voted green, lib dem, jury, christian or whoever. Thus making it more effective.
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im not saying its a protest vote. the figures speak for themselves. the labour vote collapsed so far as to allow the bnp in, under the proportional representation system, of which across the country only 30% of people bothered to go and vote...

its when people dont bother voting under that system thats the danger.
if i ever lived in an area in danger of a bnp incursion, id make sure id get everyone out i know to vote.
 
matt collins said:
But it is not anyone elses business how people vote. As far as I'm concerned it is not morally viable to vote for them but it is everyones own right to vote for who they want it's not for me or you to judge them.
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What if people vote for a party that takes away your liberty, a party that creates division and hate in your society?

-the only thing we learn from history is that we don't learn from history-
 
Hang on, before this runs away with itself, I'm not playing advocate here. I'm just engaging in debate with you about it.

Personally speaking their policies both sicken me and make me laugh in their niavity I'm just as ashamed they have been voted in as the rest of you. But they have been voted in and theres nothing we can do about it now.

I guess I was just trying to think of the mindset of people to actually vote for them and why they did it, also to raise the point that with all the fuss surrounding them, there's the danger it could actually play into their hands.
 
those people throwing eggs are muppets, imo

it's student union gesture bollox at its worst. I saw all this first hand in my a-level days.. a lot of people making a lot of noise and achieving sweet FA

By yelling and calling them nazis and hounding them, you create 'martyrs' of its leadership - to someone unfamiliar with UK politics, say a new voter watching that on telly - the anti-fascists look more aggressive, more extreme and more intransigent than the guys in suits. PR battle round 1 lost.

the smart way to take on the BNP is to start recognising (through gritted teeth) they now have some legitimacy and need to be respected as an electoral force. The way to confront them is to challenge them and their rants in debate, issue-by-issue.

If you engage the BNP in respectful debate, they will soon crumble because they are hopeless amateurs with nothing but nasty intolerant views, effectively bar stool preachers with no clear policies and no ideas about running anything.

I saw this first hand at a debate in bethnal green when Richard Barnbrook in the full glare of the light, just ranted about knife crime without having a clue what he was on about. He was mocked by the whole audience. That is effective democracy and a far more effective way of defeating the BNP than by mob tactics which are out of date and do nothing to address the reason WHY the BNP are getting THOUSANDS of votes from predominantly EX-LABOUR voters..

that is a much more deep-rooted and complex societal problem and simply focussing on the BNP isn't really going to address that...
 
matt collins said:
Hang on, before this runs away with itself, I'm not playing advocate here. I'm just engaging in debate with you about it.

Personally speaking their policies both sicken me and make me laugh in their niavity I'm just as ashamed they have been voted in as the rest of you. But they have been voted in and theres nothing we can do about it now.

I guess I was just trying to think of the mindset of people to actually vote for them and why they did it, also to raise the point that with all the fuss surrounding them, there's the danger it could actually play into their hands.
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:lol::lol::lol: lasted long enough for the mud to stick i'm afraid!

Fierce Angel in BNP Vote Shocker
 
matt collins said:
Yes that's true also and either one is better than voting BNP but please don't blame 'apathetic tossers' for letting the BNP in.
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but....it was the apathetic ones who let them in.

they mobilised everyone who supported them and they voted for them.

The BNP polled fewer votes this time than last time.

I posted the below in another thread so apols for the duplication, if you run with its hypothesis then it is not much to worry about in terms of numbers. In fact the added exposure would hopefully demolish their arguments (as said above, let Paxman take him to pieces):

http://www.manchesterconfidential.com/index.asp?Sessionx=IpqiNw86JDxoIpqiNwF6IHqi
 
agentundercover said:
but....it was the apathetic ones who let them in.
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I think thats a pretty thin argument.

It's actually the people who voted for them that got them in. I don't buy all this you must vote or the BNP get in bollocks.

What we do need to do, you're right is get them in front of Paxman and the question time audience, that I agree with you 100% as I have mentioned before.

Stop even calling them a protest vote and generally show them up for the morons they are. Hopefully when they make a complete mess of it they'll never get in again.
 
matt collins said:
I think thats a pretty thin argument.

It's actually the people who voted for them that got them in. I don't buy all this you must vote or the BNP get in bollocks.
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half the labour lot up there didnt bother voting. if everyone stayed at home thinking that the BNP had no chance of getting in and then one prat voted BNP among 12 or so alternative candidates, is said prat the one who should be shouted at for voting?

if you cant be bothered to vote. dont moan about the crackpots who may in!
 
it is worth noting though, that people in this country don't generally give a fat fuk about the euro-elections, hence mass apathy - nobody knows or cares what the european parliament does, so those who do bother feel they have the luxury of being able to stick one to the national government - the greens, ukip and bnp have all benefited at the expense of the big players in various euro elections over the last 20 years, so that does corrupt the stats with a lot of people thinking it doesn't really matter who I vote for because it won't affect the house of commons. It is a very dangerous attitude to hold though - and this is what happens... despite everything though, it is as good as it will ever get ever get for the bnp... just a shame £800,000 of european taxpayers' money will be wasted on their expenses... :rolleyes:
 
apparently so..

£400,000 per MEP in European salary + office + travel expenses.... presumably other perks too...
 
A few awkward moments ahead for them I think when discussing policy with foreign counter parts...

"So what does the BNP stand for then"

"Well if you're a foreigner, then we think you're rubbish"

"....."
 
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