Barack Obama

Morbyd

Morbyd

Moderator
I know there's a couple of Obama fans among you (grego? russ?). Anyone see/read his big speech this week? Just watched it (slow day at work :lol:). Could this man BE any more articulate?

He basically knocked back criticism of his relationship with his somewhat psychotic (or just plain angry?) priest, who's off-color quotes have apparently been TV and newspaper fodder in the US for the past few days.

But he did it as part of a sweeping treatise on race relations in the US and his unique place in it (being bi-racial). Extremely well written, calmly delivered, nearly had me in tears towards the end.

I was having doubts.... still do... but this really looks like the real deal.
 
Saw it on the news here this morning and the local stations were giving it a lot of credibility.

Do you think he has got better at speeches since the writers strike ended?

:p:lol:
 
Could you post a link, please.

Obama is a great "orateur". I hope he'll be the next prez.
 
He can talk the talk but can he walk the walk?

I hope he gets in, although as long as McCain stands firm against the neo-conservative bible-bashing right-wingers in his party, I don't mind if he gets in. I just don't like the idea of Hillary Clinton in charge.
 
gingerfreak said:
He can talk the talk but can he walk the walk?

I hope he gets in, although as long as McCain stands firm against the neo-conservative bible-bashing right-wingers in his party, I don't mind if he gets in. I just don't like the idea of Hillary Clinton in charge.
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It's a valid question. And we really just don't know. It's a leap of faith, to some degree. But we've got to hope that with is background he can reach out to a lot of people around the world that other American leaders can't or won't.

I could live with McCain. Disagree with him on staying in Iraq, although I do have a sense of "you broke it, you fix it" in the back of my mind. But he's shown a strong moderate streak over the years. He might be a bit too old now, though... not like 8 years ago when I wish he'd beaten Bush in the primaries!
 
hello


fortune favours the brave in this life and my man has shown real cojones again.

As far back as his breakthrough speech at the DNC in 2004 he has been saying ' there is not a black america, not a white america but a united states of america. not a liberal america and a conservative america but a united states of america'. This is just the latest manifestation of his pitch.

After his pastor got caught saying some deeply shady things, Obama could have swept it under the carpet but decided to tackle the race issue head on and i think this will be the moment his path to Commander in Chief really opens up.


full text here:
http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/stateupdates/gGBbTW

not sure how hillary is gonna top this one
 
Morbyd said:
I know there's a couple of Obama fans among you (grego? russ?). Anyone see/read his big speech this week? Just watched it (slow day at work :lol:). Could this man BE any more articulate?

He basically knocked back criticism of his relationship with his somewhat psychotic (or just plain angry?) priest, who's off-color quotes have apparently been TV and newspaper fodder in the US for the past few days.

But he did it as part of a sweeping treatise on race relations in the US and his unique place in it (being bi-racial). Extremely well written, calmly delivered, nearly had me in tears towards the end.

I was having doubts.... still do... but this really looks like the real deal.
Click to expand...

(why are you questioning if i'm a fan!!:spank:)

his best speech of the campaign thus far in my opinion was the san antonio one (http://www.barackobama.com/tv/speeches.php). for me, he is the epitome of what modern politics should be about. he answers in a clear, straightforward manner with a clear rationale for everything he says. (the only person who comes close to this in british politics is george osbourne - and he is miles away AND i disagree with most of his policies).

hilary is straight out of the mayor quimby textbook of how to answer a question. she has to depend on her script when delivering as litle as 5 or 6 words. her main tactic throughout the process has been to try and dig up bad news on obama. she also uses Bill's time in the white house only when it suits. i.e. happy to be part of the successes but distances herself from the failures. an example of how she gives a straight answer is here (and showcases obama's wit):

Obama began by recalling a moment in Tuesday night's debate when he and his rivals were asked to name their biggest weakness. Obama answered first, saying he has a messy desk and needs help managing paperwork _ something his opponents have since used to suggest he's not up to managing the country. John Edwards said his biggest weakness is that he has a powerful response to seeing pain in others, and Clinton said she gets impatient to bring change to America.

"Because I'm an ordinary person, I thought that they meant, 'What's your biggest weakness?'" Obama said to laughter from a packed house at Rancho High School. "If I had gone last I would have known what the game was. And then I could have said, `Well, ya know, I like to help old ladies across the street. Sometimes they don't want to be helped. It's terrible.'"
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by the way, anyone who hasn't seen barack's website, then please go look. the website is as articulate as he is. it clearly sets out his policies, opinions, feelings, ambitions broken down into states, target audience, issue. www.barackobama.com/

yes we can! sí se puede!!:D
 
grego said:
(why are you questioning if i'm a fan!!:spank:)
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Only questioning if you were around :lol: Your faith in Barack remains unquestioned!

This is one reason this guy excites me. If people around the world see Obama as someone they can deal with, someone they can relate to, then he's well-placed to put the US back on the path to being a good citizen on this planet and one that a lot of people don't dislike so much as now.
 
well as an american im sorta interested on how much the international world hears about our elections. personally i feel mccain IS a neo-con, maybe not as bad as bush... but he really beleives this war in iraq (and afghanistan) is something we should be commited to for the next century and he promised the prime minister of iraq to do just that... im sure you all notice how well the us economy is doing.... spending 1.2 trillion dollars a year doesnt help. the only "real" republican that ran this year was ron paul! but unfortunatley the american public isnt quite ready for that sort of drastic change... obama seems alright i would rather him be president than any of the other candidates but i still dont think he is the bests man for the job at this point in time!
 
Hey Loganradish, are you a fellow American abroad?

Ya, the economy is in tatters right now. I like Ron Paul too. Very common sense approach to some issues. But I would assume his libertarian leanings would have meant the same hands-off approach the Bush administration had to the financial industry, which is what got us into this mess.
 
McCain for me.

Amusing cartoon in the Times RE: Obama

Picture copyright Peter Brooks (Times)

cartoon-385_307271a.jpg
 
Morbyd said:
Hey Loganradish, are you a fellow American abroad?
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yes i am abroad, but in the worst possible way! yeah i think ron, would of taken a more hands off approach to the fiscal dealings of our country, but his foreign policies rock wich affect me just as much (if not more than the economic policies) granted i dont htink the dems universal health plan stuff is gonna help our economy any either as well as mccains war plans for that matter, but if i had to choose i think i would rather have free medical than dead soldiers!
 
Here's my prediction: If Obama wins the nomination, McCain will be the next president.

There are several reasons why I think this. I'm reading Fear and Loathing on the Campaign Trail at the moment and think there are some striking parallels between Obama's and George McGovern's bids for the presidency.

The first is seasoned commentators have said that Obama's economic policies are probably the most liberal in the American sense - i.e. leftwing in European terms - of any candidate since McGovern. This point - combined with Obama's lack of experience in actually running anything - will get hammered by Republicans and their allies in business and the media if he's nominated. Never mind a Black president, are Americans ready for a Liberal one, especially when recession's looming?

Another similarity: McGovern promised to end the war in Vietnam, just as Obama's pledged to pull troops out of Iraq as soon as possible but will enough voters feel that is the right move, when all's said and done?

Before that, the way the Democratic primaries are going at the moment, the nomination is going to get decided at the convention. There's a jaw-dropping section in Fear and Loathing on the Campaign Trail in which Thompson talks to two of McGovern's fixers about the procedural shenanigans that went on at the 1972 convention to secure the nomination. If it comes down to backroom manoeuvres to sew up superdelegates, I suspect 2008 could make 1972 look like a vicarage tea party. Whoever comes out of that mess as the candidate, they're going to have the baggage of an extremely bitter and divisive convention to live down. Clinton would weather it better as people expect dirty politics of her.

Then there's Pastor Wright, who's this year's equivalent of the veep debacle McGovern walked into. He chose as his running mate a man with a history of having electro shock treatments for depression. Somehow McGovern and his staff did not know this before they chose Tom Eagleton, after Ted Kennedy said no. McGovern didn't handle that episode very well at all and it badly damaged him, even after Eagleton stepped down from the vice-presidential candidacy.

The difference of course is Obama's incredible speech, in which I have to say I think he did an absolutely amazing job of putting the pastor's comments in context, disagreeing with him without disowning him. Some people are calling it the greatest speech on race since Martin Luther King told people I Have a Dream.

But great speeches do not great leaders make and the pastor will lose Obama many - probably too many - white votes. If they can't go to Clinton, those votes will go to McCain. They could very well be decisive.

America may be ready for a Black president but not one whose close confidantes have been caught on camera bawling God Damn America.
 
An astute analysis, Digger.

In fact, a couple of weeks ago, McGovern was a guest on the Colbert Report and they went through some of the similarities.

You're right about Wright as well. If Pennsylvania polling tells us anything, it's that the association with this guy (and probably specifically Wright's God Damn America speech) has hurt Obama among white working class voters.

But.... the one saving grace, should he be nominated, might be Obama's ability to inspire. Can you get out more young voters, minorities and well-educated people (Obama's strongholds) to counterbalance the other people going the other way? People have to take the trip to the voting station, and McCain isn't exciting people so much.

Obama's economic policies aren't quite as liberal as they're made out to be. He's being given the label progressive by some neutrals. His voting record in the Senate, which some conservative commentators claim is the most liberal, is actually pretty much party-line votes.
 
Morbyd said:
But.... the one saving grace, should he be nominated, might be Obama's ability to inspire. Can you get out more young voters, minorities and well-educated people (Obama's strongholds) to counterbalance the other people going the other way? People have to take the trip to the voting station, and McCain isn't exciting people so much.

Obama's economic policies aren't quite as liberal as they're made out to be. He's being given the label progressive by some neutrals. His voting record in the Senate, which some conservative commentators claim is the most liberal, is actually pretty much party-line votes.
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Obama is clearly more "inspirational" than McGovern was in personal charisma terms. You could not imagine Obama walking into a press room on his own, and not being recognised, even early on in his campaign for the nomination, as Hunter Thompson said happened in McGovern's case in one of the first primaries.

But Thompson also makes clear that McGovern was the only candidate in 1972 who had a chance of tapping into the huge potential coalition of hippies, blacks and first time voters that was otherwise going unrepresented by the mainstream Democrat candidates.

As a Limey, I may well be wrong but I don't think Obama has that once-in-a-generation constituency to appeal to. He has to take votes from the same sources as Clinton and McCain, particularly blue-collar whites.

They may do the famous "could I sit down and have a beer with the guy" test that the rest of the world so loves about American presidential elections and conclude that they could.

But they'd probably want to chuck the contents of the can all over someone like Wright.

On a random note, Wright looks disconcertingly like a bloke who's in a spot of bother in my home town called Lee Jasper.
 
Digger said:
Here's my prediction: If Obama wins the nomination, McCain will be the next president.
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I hope old Digger was wrong because it looks like Barack is going to sew it up tonight.

Aside from probably winning the majority of Democratic convention delegates in today's last primaries in South Dakota and Montana, news agencies are reporting that enough of these so-called superdelegates are planning to announce today so as to put Obama over the top.

AP also reports that Hillary will conceed that Barack has won the delegate race in her speech in NYC tonight.

I especially love Obama's pluck... scheduled his victory speech tonight in the arena that will hold the Republican convention this summer in St. Paul, Minnesota :lol:

Edit: just saw that Clinton's campaign refuted that AP report... she just doesn't know when to quit! :lol:

2nd edit: A new Gallup poll has Obama beating McCain 47%-44%
 
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loganradish said:
yes i am abroad, but in the worst possible way! yeah i think ron, would of taken a more hands off approach to the fiscal dealings of our country, but his foreign policies rock wich affect me just as much (if not more than the economic policies) granted i dont htink the dems universal health plan stuff is gonna help our economy any either as well as mccains war plans for that matter, but if i had to choose i think i would rather have free medical than dead soldiers!
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And to think we could all have this if we didnt spend so much money in the overseas dust pit of a nation IRAQ and spent money on other important things like health care!!Where up to over 3 trillion! We should of been in and out period.....Iraq is filled with the most retarded poeple in the world.We are fighting a bunch of retards.Has to stop because we are making no progress!!

This is what im talking about!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6o_S1VSaxeU
 
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Uh, I've had friends from Iraq. One was even a roomate when I lived in your neck of the woods, Scribs. None were, as far as I could tell, mentally impaired.

But if you mean to say that invading Iraq was an ill-advised, or at least ill-planned, and expensive foreign policy decision that took money and attention from other more pressing issues, then you've got a point.
 
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