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Neo95gt

Well-Known Member
I understand why the stigma might continue to exist, but with Cocoon aside from a tiny area directly behind the DJ booth reserved for artists, employees and guests, the tiered VIP area at the back of the club is free for all to come and go as they please.
Didn’t realize that. That’s cool, still a weird fit imo.
 

soha

Well-Known Member
Is there a chance that pacha will have the final say on what cocon does or doesn't do.

If the numbers for cocoon for the season as a whole were low could they replace cocoon with another night.
 

mr_why

Well-Known Member
Is there a chance that pacha will have the final say on what cocon does or doesn't do.

If the numbers for cocoon for the season as a whole were low could they replace cocoon with another night.
And up to this point..... no one person has made this observation!
 

el_loco

Well-Known Member
I've come to see amnesia and cocoon as an old married couple. Over 20 years it's not always blue skies and plain sailing. You have your arguments and make eyes at someone else for self confidence. You may even want to decide to break up, and see what's out there for you, try others. But all that only helps you to understand that it is actually pretty awesome what you have and you get back together :)
 

white_isle_calling

Well-Known Member
I think even Pacha know they can't pack out their club or their VIP every single night. If not Cocoon, then what? Unless there is a genuine chance of them securing Afterlife (which I assume to be very unlikely to nil), I think they'd be better off sticking than twisting.
Even their commercial parties experienced the dip reported across the board.
No doubt they will look at their weekly program as a whole. There are already rumours of tinkering, if not dramatic change. My bet is that they will at least try to accommodate Cocoon from the outset before negotiations get seriously discussed.
 

elmooreo

Well-Known Member
If it is the last ever cocoon season...surely the final final party will be a privi full club special? Similar to space closing, everyone is going to want a piece no?
 

john454

Active Member
Not to do with lower numbers. Merely a demographic that prefers to be on the dance floor, instead of seated and spending over the odds bottles. Was always the same at Amnesia too.

When the switch was announced, there were several suggestions made that Cocoon had no interest in entertaining the VIP crowd.
Maybe Pacha would have hoped for a few more VIPs, but certainly they knew what they were getting in terms of Cocoon's stance.
Low numbers of VIP, I should clarify. They wouldn't be turned away or sent to GA entry if they were there.

They didn't want to entertain people who would spend money? Interesting concept. I agree they knew what they were getting, as the balcony at Amnesia was dead for the past couple of years, but lets not kid ourselves that this was a back to basics play by either the club or Cocoon.


Would love to be wrong here, and genuinely interested if you can point me in the direction of statements to support this, its a welcome approach that the island needs. To see Cocoon being the flag bearer for it would be great.
 

Vinyldreams

Active Member
Not to do with lower numbers. Merely a demographic that prefers to be on the dance floor, instead of seated and spending over the odds bottles. Was always the same at Amnesia too.

When the switch was announced, there were several suggestions made that Cocoon had no interest in entertaining the VIP crowd.
Maybe Pacha would have hoped for a few more VIPs, but certainly they knew what they were getting in terms of Cocoon's stance.
I bet it’s not cocoons decision ,
 

white_isle_calling

Well-Known Member
They didn't want to entertain people who would spend money? Interesting concept. I agree they knew what they were getting, as the balcony at Amnesia was dead for the past couple of years, but lets not kid ourselves that this was a back to basics play by either the club or Cocoon.
Depends from which perspective - Pacha or Cocoon's? VIP is the venue's money-maker (as is the restaurant in Pacha's case). Generally speaking, if you're a promoter you want people buying general admission tickets not VIP. That's where you're judged, and that's where you typically make the most money. Of course it depends on the clauses of the contract - who takes the door/what is the door split, does the promoter get any % of bar sales, who pays for artists etc. Essentially, there are a lot of variables - moreso in a venue as multi-faceted as Pacha (they have complimentary admission for hotel guests too, don't forget). These are details I can only speculate on.
Of course, it will vary from party to party. Solomun will likely have a very lucrative VIP deal since a) VIP is banged out every Sunday and b) you regularly can't squeeze anybody else through the door for GA. He is likely an exception to the rule, though.
 

white_isle_calling

Well-Known Member
Would love to be wrong here, and genuinely interested if you can point me in the direction of statements to support this, its a welcome approach that the island needs. To see Cocoon being the flag bearer for it would be great.
One quote I was alluding to was from the Sven/Cocoon feature in Mixmag's June 2018 edition:

"... Many of the team were insecure: "Is Pacha the right club?" We knew that there was a new owner (since last year) and we knew they wanted to change things. It's going to be a different Pacha and we want to be part of it. They will focus much more on the dance floor and they will extend the dance floor."

Pretty sure there was another, maybe on facebook and/or Instagram, which was basically along the lines of "we understand why our long-term fans might be unsure, but trust us that Cocoon will not lose it's ethos."
 

john454

Active Member
Depends from which perspective - Pacha or Cocoon's? VIP is the venue's money-maker (as is the restaurant in Pacha's case). Generally speaking, if you're a promoter you want people buying general admission tickets not VIP. That's where you're judged, and that's where you typically make the most money. Of course it depends on the clauses of the contract - who takes the door/what is the door split, does the promoter get any % of bar sales, who pays for artists etc. Essentially, there are a lot of variables - moreso in a venue as multi-faceted as Pacha (they have complimentary admission for hotel guests too, don't forget). These are details I can only speculate on.
Of course, it will vary from party to party. Solomun will likely have a very lucrative VIP deal since a) VIP is banged out every Sunday and b) you regularly can't squeeze anybody else through the door for GA. He is likely an exception to the rule, though.

The two (full VIP and general access) aren't mutually exclusive, as Solomun proves (and Cocoon used to!). Cocoon might not care from a financial perspective if the club is full of VIP, spending money on tables that they never see, is your point they would prefer not to have these people at all to the detriment of the club being busier? There aren't many clubbers that are going to opt for GA over VIP if they can (genuinely) afford it.
 

white_isle_calling

Well-Known Member
Cocoon might not care from a financial perspective if the club is full of VIP, spending money on tables that they never see, is your point they would prefer not to have these people at all to the detriment of the club being busier?
Whilst I'll be the first to admit it isn't quite so simple, the VIP crowd tend to migrate to the most popular parties.
I am not anti-VIP as some on these forums. I do see the benefit. But Cocoon - partly because it isn't "flavour of the month" but also because it still commands a loyal old school mentality following - is top heavy on clubbers vs VIP.
There were probably more VIPs at Tuesdays On Mars with Fatboy Slim for example. But were there as many people on the dance floor?
I agree, they're not mutually exclusive. But I disagree that most "clubbers" would rather go VIP than GA if they could afford to - at least in the traditional and certainly the Cocoon crowd sense - that is a contradiction in terms. Cocoon already has one the oldest average age compared to their direct competitors, so therefore also safe to assume they have more disposable income too.
 

john454

Active Member
Whilst I'll be the first to admit it isn't quite so simple, the VIP crowd tend to migrate to the most popular parties.
I am not anti-VIP as some on these forums. I do see the benefit. But Cocoon - partly because it isn't "flavour of the month" but also because it still commands a loyal old school mentality following - is top heavy on clubbers vs VIP.
There were probably more VIPs at Tuesdays On Mars with Fatboy Slim for example. But were there as many people on the dance floor?
I agree, they're not mutually exclusive. But I disagree that most "clubbers" would rather go VIP than GA if they could afford to - at least in the traditional and certainly the Cocoon crowd sense - that is a contradiction in terms. Cocoon already has one the oldest average age compared to their direct competitors, so therefore also safe to assume they have more disposable income too.
With out wishing to ignite a VIP argument I always saw it as 3 parts. Part 1 is normal, maybe slightly better earners that do it for a night or two as something a bit special, which I think is the reference for the Cocoon demographic which is probbaly fair. Part 2 is people who are genuine clubbers and like to party but also happen to be very wealthy, and will shrug their shoulders at 5k bill on their Centurion. Part 3 who are people that just want to go to the hot parties, and again a 5k bill is largely irrelevant.

I would be interested to see how the spend splits, but if you're in group 2 or 3, chances are slim you will go somewhere without a table. Overall I think we agree on the Cocoon demographic, but they arent pioneering a low VIP club by choice.
 

white_isle_calling

Well-Known Member
Actually don't know the answer to this myself, but do Pacha allow everyone to walk around VIP on other nights - even if there are no paying VIPs??
 

Neo95gt

Well-Known Member
Any clubs going under construction this offseason? Seems like there’s been a lot of that the last 2 years.
 

McRackin

Moderator
there's been private smoking clubs on the island for a long while (btw, one of the longest-standing ones linked to a famous disco...) so what was next? an exclu$ive/luxury private smoking club with music license!

 
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