wiki-confused

O

Olly

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so Australian dude nobody has heard of receives loads of US official secrets and puts them on his website and embarasses every country on the planet and now the US want to execute him for treason even though he's not American or a traitor but before that they also want him to be tried in Sweden for raping-not-raping two swedes who may or may not be CIA connected and everything is crystal clear as mud. And Obama is great but the Feds are bad, right?

Why are the goodies and who are the baddies? - can someone answer?

USA - goodies or baddies?
North Korea - goodies or baddies?
Russia
London
Scotland
The People's Republic of China
The Ayatollah
The Internet
 
Only one idiot (Sarah Palin) has used the word treason. She's not bright enough to realize that only relates to citizens.

The official line is that they're looking into charges of espionage, and if such charges could apply under the law.

The kid who is thought to have passed the documents on to Wikileaks is already in custody. Military hacker kid who'd been stationed in the Middle East. He is not going to have a happy life.

As for the documents themselves, at least the Russian-related ones I've read through, it's just basically chatter. Diplomats passing on what they've heard and what various people have told them. Pretty useless stuff.

The one document. for which I thought the publication of it was a travesty, was the list of strategic sites around the world (infrastructure, vital industrial enterprises, etc.). They've just basically granted terrorists a shopping list. So, when the world's only producer of a vaccine for X disease, based in some small Italian city, gets blown up and we've got a health crisis, we'll know who to blame.

I'm all for government transparency and such, but I can't see a defense for what Wikileaks is doing. It's stolen property. If I stole your car and then drove around the city with the contents of your glove compartment taped to all the windows for all to see, what'd be the result? :confused:
 
you don't think people have a right to know if their governments are lying to them and pursuing illegal policies under diplomatic cover? In that sense, tranparency is vital

Also - do you think this guy is being stitched up or is it mere coincidence he is pursued for a seemingly unrelated criminal offence?
 
Olly said:
you don't think people have a right to know if their governments are lying to them and pursuing illegal policies under diplomatic cover? In that sense, tranparency is vital
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But we have legal systems. We have freedom of information laws. There are legal ways to force the release of documents. These were stolen. That's the part that I can't condone.

And diplomatic cables are exactly the types of documents that are usually released (but usually years later when they can cause no harm)

Olly said:
Also - do you think this guy is being stitched up or is it mere coincidence he is pursued for a seemingly unrelated criminal offence?
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It certainly is suspicious. Could easily be a stitch-up. Could not be.

Assange's lawyer admitted there was sex, adding that it was unprotected. It could be as simple as 2 women pissed off they've got herpes thanks to this guy refusing to wear a hat.

Or he could be a rapist. Who knows?
 
the fact that they were stolen, however, also means that the public get to see the WHOLE TRUTH rather than the filtered truth. We have the 30 year rules whereby minor cabinet papers from say 1980 are finally released but it's only ever unimportant stuff and years after anyone cares. If it requires illegal action to expose government policymaking which is criminal/borderline criminal then the end justifies the means imo
 
this is legend.

article-1337014-0C685E1B000005DC-868_634x419.jpg



http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...n-Assanges-subterranean-Bond-villain-den.html
 
I'm kind of with Morbs in that its impossible to run a country without some kind of diplomacy...there will always be emotionally charged conversations happening in the lead up to forming an official line on something, and this needs to be filtered out in a structured way.

The worst possible way to release this stuff is through the mainstream media who will have a field day sensationalising everything...and did the stuff that was released say anything we were particularly surprised by? Errrr no.

However, there is a big but. The above assumes you have trust in the motives of the government. I don't. At all.

Therefore I'm loving the new open source web revolution and the impact this is having on the freedom of information. I'd like to see it bring the government to it's knees tbh.
 
I did think the list of key sites was the only one that may have been a bad idea to make public. Everything else seems to be opinions about other countries and its not one sided , everyone's having a dig so it doesnt seem so bad
 
MiniMarc said:
I did think the list of key sites was the only one that may have been a bad idea to make public. Everything else seems to be opinions about other countries and its not one sided , everyone's having a dig so it doesnt seem so bad
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...agreed - but the broader point is that we shouldn't accept the fact that sensitive issues around national security are controlled by the few at the top. We're duped into thinking we're not in some strange cult and buy into someone else's definition of 'freedom of information'.

The Swedish trial was blatantly only dredged up again because of an agenda within the US government. This isn't even slightly ok imo.
 
Robder said:
The Swedish trial was blatantly only dredged up again because of an agenda within the US government. This isn't even slightly ok imo.
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There's no trial in Sweden. He hasn't even been charged. He's just wanted for questioning.

And the two cases are new, not dredged up.

The timing is very suspect. But I'm also very hesitant to call women liars when they accuse someone of rape.
 
oops I stand corrected then - I was under the impression that this case had already come to a conclusion ages ago and was suddenly being heard a second time.
 
I think the rape charges are very coincidental.

:confused:

Also the fact that the Lockerbie bomber Megrahi has suddenly fallen into a final coma, hours after the Wikileaks cables released controversial info regarding the negotiations surrounding his release

:confused:

I also think that Assange looks like the Tory School hatchet man Micheal Gove.

And is therefore probably a bellend.

I think wikileaks agenda seems less about freedom of information and more about the ego of a group of people who thinkwide scale international **** stirring is going to improve the world.

how?

Like jack nicholson once said "THE TRUTH? YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!"

:eek:
 
The leaks are embarrassing but the value to the public is minimal. The charges against Assange in Sweden seem dubious, but he is only wanted for questioning for rape and molestation. I don't know what molestation is in Sweden (unprotected sex, girl was under age?) He has refused to answer questions and said they are trumped up. Who knows he could be a rich perv.
 
In support of Wikileaks, A group of Hackers named "Anonymous" have hacked and disrupted all the companies that supported the American attack on Wikileaks. i.e Mastercard, Visa and Paypal.

Fundamental fact.....Power corrupts, wheather its the Romans, English, Russians, Jamaicans or Americans, people in power will always try to control the environment around them and protect their interests.

The Americans control World power at present and they will eliminate a perceived threat to that position by any means possible.

There is only one outcome to this situation the neutralisation of Wikileaks.
 
djjaycool said:
You can never be too prepared for the Apocalypse:lol::lol::lol:
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:lol: Word.

I read an article earlier this year about a US company charging £50,000 a head to reserve a place in one of their underground shelters in case of asteroid, plague, nuclear attack, zombie outbreak etc.

It looked really convincing.

But it seemed a bit of a leap of faith, I mean if Armageddon came, it's not as if you would be able to get your money back if they didn't let you in :lol:
 
Bez said:
In support of Wikileaks, A group of Hackers named "Anonymous" have hacked and disrupted all the companies that supported the American attack on Wikileaks. i.e Mastercard, Visa and Paypal.

Fundamental fact.....Power corrupts, wheather its the Romans, English, Russians, Jamaicans or Americans, people in power will always try to control the environment around them and protect their interests.

The Americans control World power at present and they will eliminate a perceived threat to that position by any means possible.

There is only one outcome to this situation the neutralisation of Wikileaks.
Click to expand...

There's no "controlling" it now. Wikileaks has over 1000 mirror sites already, as well as all the documents archived in encrypted form for which they've just got to release a key to the online community. It can't be neutralized.

The Operation Payback, by Anonymous & friends, is an interesting reaction. Vigilante justice against companies who decided not to support Wikileaks? Doesn't much take into account innocent bystanders (eg. consumers using those payment systems). Cyber terrorism! :lol:
 
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