POOR INNOCENT MAN THAT WAS SHOT

[mambobirdette]

He was probably running because he was scared shitless

Still doesnt explain why he jumped the barrier , if it was a group of ppl in plain clothes pointing as gun at me, id of probably thought about doing the same thing.

Just goes to show that some people exaggerate too, there was a witness report on the news that said he saw the man wearing a bomb belt with wires haging out the bottom of his coat - RUBBISH!!!

 

[djchewie]

He was probably running because he was scared shitless

Still doesnt explain why he jumped the barrier , if it was a group of ppl in plain clothes pointing as gun at me, id of probably thought about doing the same thing.

Just goes to show that some people exaggerate too, there was a witness report on the news that said he saw the man wearing a bomb belt with wires haging out the bottom of his coat - RUBBISH!!!

Police have a job to do. and i would imagine they would have shouted "ARMED POLICE STOP!" why someone would run off and jump the barrier in the present climate is beyond me.

 

[stuie]

With the current situation in London on the Underground you have got to be a bloody idiot not to stop when you have people pointing guns at you shouting "Armed Police"

 

[Scoobie]

He was probably running because he was scared shitless

Still doesnt explain why he jumped the barrier , if it was a group of ppl in plain clothes pointing as gun at me, id of probably thought about doing the same thing.

Just goes to show that some people exaggerate too, there was a witness report on the news that said he saw the man wearing a bomb belt with wires haging out the bottom of his coat - RUBBISH!!!

Police have a job to do. and i would imagine they would have shouted "ARMED POLICE STOP!" why someone would run off and jump the barrier in the present climate is beyond me.

There is some dispute over whether that actually happened. Some witnesses are reporting that all they did was shouted 'stop' as they got their guns out.

 

[djchewie]

who knows.

bottom line is police have a difficult job to do, and although tragic this shooting is, should deflect from the real issue that the 4 idoits are still loose and some people DO know where they are.

 

[Buckley]

Terrible tragedy. Until we know more I'm giving the Police the benefit of the doubt. If he had been a bomber and he'd run and got on the tube and blown lots of people up they'd be criticised if they'd not acted as they did.

If they haven't identified themselves as Police you can understand him running, but equally in the current climate, if they did and he had nothing to hide, he should of stopped.

There are no winners in all of this.

 

[x-amount]

He was probably running because he was scared shitless

Still doesnt explain why he jumped the barrier , if it was a group of ppl in plain clothes pointing as gun at me, id of probably thought about doing the same thing.

Just goes to show that some people exaggerate too, there was a witness report on the news that said he saw the man wearing a bomb belt with wires haging out the bottom of his coat - RUBBISH!!!

Police have a job to do. and i would imagine they would have shouted "ARMED POLICE STOP!" why someone would run off and jump the barrier in the present climate is beyond me.

There is some dispute over whether that actually happened. Some witnesses are reporting that all they did was shouted 'stop' as they got their guns out.

I'm sure week 1, lesson 1, on the introduction to SO19 school of Rules of Combat, they teach you to announce you are the pplice and your intention to shoot.

Both sides of the argument don't sit well with me, I must say.

My prevailing instinct in discussing this is to defend the common theory that the police doing the shooting aren't anything but the best trained officers in the world.

I think some ridiculously low amount of bullets have actually been fired in the last 20 years by these guys. Every bullet has a serial number and it's own investigation by default. I think most officers pray to go through their lives by not having to fire anything.

I think m any people have the impression the gun dept of the Met is a bunch of bloodthirsty paintball pro's looking to justify their next kill.

I'm just glad I only press buttons for a living.

 

[Coffeetime]

if these police are trained swat police.. then why kill the guy???
the guy never had a gun! so there was no need to fire!
they could have just shot him in the leg!!!
their are no excuses for killing the guy!!! that cop murdered an innocent man when he could have just shot him in the leg and he knows it!!

 

[Scoobie]

He was probably running because he was scared shitless

Still doesnt explain why he jumped the barrier , if it was a group of ppl in plain clothes pointing as gun at me, id of probably thought about doing the same thing.

Just goes to show that some people exaggerate too, there was a witness report on the news that said he saw the man wearing a bomb belt with wires haging out the bottom of his coat - RUBBISH!!!

Police have a job to do. and i would imagine they would have shouted "ARMED POLICE STOP!" why someone would run off and jump the barrier in the present climate is beyond me.

There is some dispute over whether that actually happened. Some witnesses are reporting that all they did was shouted 'stop' as they got their guns out.

I'm sure week 1, lesson 1, on the introduction to SO19 school of Rules of Combat, they teach you to announce you are the pplice and your intention to shoot.

Both sides of the argument don't sit well with me, I must say.

My prevailing instinct in discussing this is to defend the common theory that the police doing the shooting aren't anything but the best trained officers in the world.

I think some ridiculously low amount of bullets have actually been fired in the last 20 years by these guys. Every bullet has a serial number and it's own investigation by default. I think most officers pray to go through their lives by not having to fire anything.

I think m any people have the impression the gun dept of the Met is a bunch of bloodthirsty paintball pro's looking to justify their next kill.

I'm just glad I only press buttons for a living.

Actually Dan I agree with you completely. was just passing on what this mornings reports are saying

 

[Buckley]

if these police are trained swat police.. then why kill the guy???
the guy never had a gun! so there was no need to fire!
they could have just shot him in the leg!!!
their are no excuses for killing the guy!!! that cop murdered an innocent man when he could have just shot him in the leg and he knows it!!

Simply maiming a suicide bomber would not stop him detonating a bomb.

 

[stephen]

please lets be sensible here.

the police have to shoot to kill. a wounded would be suicide bomber can still explode the bomb and kill or mutilate more people.

ps can we not let this thread deteriorate into a flame fest?

 

[Beckiboo]

if these police are trained swat police.. then why kill the guy???
the guy never had a gun! so there was no need to fire!
they could have just shot him in the leg!!!
their are no excuses for killing the guy!!! that cop murdered an innocent man when he could have just shot him in the leg and he knows it!!

But what if he was a suicide bomber, and after the police had shot him in the leg, he then reached down and detonated his bomb, killing more civilians?
You just never know what kind of person you're dealing with. I believe the police saw him as a bomb threat and so used whatever force they thought necessary. The fact that they were wrong is tragic, and should hopefully never happen again.

One question though, why did that guy run away, leap over the ticket barriers, and force himself onto a train if he had nothing to hide? If anyone came running at me with a gun saying "down down", whether they were police or not, I'd be on the floor in a second!

 

[Scoobie]

One question though, why did that guy run away, leap over the ticket barriers, and force himself onto a train if he had nothing to hide? If anyone came running at me with a gun saying "down down", whether they were police or not, I'd be on the floor in a second!

Yes, but you don't live in Stockwell

 

[djchewie]

hindsights wonderful aint it.

if he was a suicide bomber, most people would still be laying into the police for being incompetent.

ffs, stop telling them how to do their job. theyre not the bunch of trigger happy killers.

 

[Morbyd]

I doubt we'll ever get a true accounting of how this all went down. Did the police properly identify themselves or not? It's kind of a mute point now.

This guy was obviously not a terrorist. He had no reason to fear the police because he was in the UK legally. He appears to have been a decent individual, working for a living. I think any of us would react with fear if a bunch of guys pulled guns and started yelling... who knows if you'd even hear the words that were being said! It is truly sad that he had to die.

Somewhere I read an article characterizing Mr Mendes as yet another victim of the bombings. That's probably the right way to look at it.

 

[Buckley]

ps can we not let this thread deteriorate into a flame fest?

Here here. Be nice to think we could read, digest and think about each other's opinions before commenting in logical, reasoned matter.

 

[Stu Hirst]

He was probably running because he was scared shitless

Still doesnt explain why he jumped the barrier , if it was a group of ppl in plain clothes pointing as gun at me, id of probably thought about doing the same thing.

Just goes to show that some people exaggerate too, there was a witness report on the news that said he saw the man wearing a bomb belt with wires haging out the bottom of his coat - RUBBISH!!!

Police have a job to do. and i would imagine they would have shouted "ARMED POLICE STOP!" why someone would run off and jump the barrier in the present climate is beyond me.

There is some dispute over whether that actually happened. Some witnesses are reporting that all they did was shouted 'stop' as they got their guns out.

I'm sure week 1, lesson 1, on the introduction to SO19 school of Rules of Combat, they teach you to announce you are the pplice and your intention to shoot.

Both sides of the argument don't sit well with me, I must say.

My prevailing instinct in discussing this is to defend the common theory that the police doing the shooting aren't anything but the best trained officers in the world.

I think some ridiculously low amount of bullets have actually been fired in the last 20 years by these guys. Every bullet has a serial number and it's own investigation by default. I think most officers pray to go through their lives by not having to fire anything.

I think m any people have the impression the gun dept of the Met is a bunch of bloodthirsty paintball pro's looking to justify their next kill.

I'm just glad I only press buttons for a living.

great post.

It's also my understanding with SO19 that if you discharge a weapon during your active service, no matter the outcome of the investigation, you are removed from the unit.
You are never given the chance to fire again.
I actually believe the officers involved deserve a bravery award. As far as they were concerned, they were prepared to die doing their duty.
By all means whinge about Government policy / Intelligence, but not a Policeman doing his job.

As for the "shoot him in the leg" argument, quite possibly the funniest thing i've read on here for a while !
Under those circumstances, they are trained to shoot to kill, in this case, the head, fired at more than once to ensure instant death.

An absolute shame for the family of this guy, but unfortunately something that had the potential of happening in the current climate.

 

[wimpers]

Sorry guys, but welcome to the wild wild west! I totally not agree that shoot to kill is the way to go. If you kill someone you need to be 100% sure that he is guilty.

 

[kes]

i was asked to approach a car bya group of men late at night. They didn't disclose that they were police at first so i declined and prepared my heels for a hop it...

They then showed their badges and claimed to be CID.

So f##kin what i thought. I don't know what a CID badge looks like anyway!!

So i hopped it.

If i was someone from a place like Rio De Janero (or whereever he's from but you get the point) and a bunch of blokes started waving guns at me... i'd imagine i'd hop it too.

And if i was a copper pursuing someone i believed to have explosives round his torso i'd shoot him in the head not the torso. If i beleived he had a detonater in his hand i'd shoot him in the head so he couldn't think about triggering it whilst dieing from a leg or torso wound.

It's very sad but the way it is i feel...

 

[silvia]

Sorry guys, but welcome to the wild wild west! I totally not agree that shoot to kill is the way to go. If you kill someone you need to be 100% sure that he is guilty.

Wimpers, I'm with you too, but if you are not sure and the man is a bomber and the bomber goes into a train you have a big contradiction on here