Ibiza - quo vadis?

While I personally don't like ai model that wasn't what I thought was crazy.
It's just if there's no ai model then surely the type of customer it brings will go elsewhere and then there will be no one to replace them.
A bit like no one is replacing the clientele I'm san an at the minute.
I guess you guys that live there welcome less people?
Just seems crazy to me to alienate such a huge percentage of the tourists but I'm cynical and don't believe these people will come and spend money. I just think they'll go somewhere else all inclusive and then there's even less tourists.
 
Out of interest where will these people come from that will drink in the bars outside of the hotel?
Ibiza is already very expensive compared to a lot if not most of the similar destinations in Europe. Why will someone come and pay these prices in Ibiza when there is much better value elsewhere? Ibiza is obsessed with greed, the music policy the opening hours the alcohol bans now every has to pay pay pay while police let economic migrants steal from the tourist carte Blanche the whole ethos of the island is changing for the worst there are bleak times ahead for Ibiza in my opinion and maybe it's due a natural implosion but these changes will not be good for the island the poorest will get poorer and people won't be falling in love with the place like so many of us have over the years as it's turning into such shit hole.
Only my opinion of course and I hate to say it but the bubble is about to burst.
 
OllieNotts said:
Out of interest where will these people come from that will drink in the bars outside of the hotel?
Ibiza is already very expensive compared to a lot if not most of the similar destinations in Europe. Why will someone come and pay these prices in Ibiza when there is much better value elsewhere? Ibiza is obsessed with greed, the music policy the opening hours the alcohol bans now every has to pay pay pay while police let economic migrants steal from the tourist carte Blanche the whole ethos of the island is changing for the worst there are bleak times ahead for Ibiza in my opinion and maybe it's due a natural implosion but these changes will not be good for the island the poorest will get poorer and people won't be falling in love with the place like so many of us have over the years as it's turning into such shit hole.
Only my opinion of course and I hate to say it but the bubble is about to burst.
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don't have the time to properly respond right now (because it'll be a long reply), but as much as I understand your point of view, the future isn't as dark as you paint it.
 
stivi said:
what‘s so crazy about it? the bars outside the hotels would love it. all inclusive is a pest for all the small businesses and AI needs to be erradicated
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Totally agree with this, was in Majorca for a stag recently and although it’s not my kind of place. It’s totally killed the bar culture there. The folk who own BCM have AI in all their hotels, basically people go from the hotel to the club and back with little in between.
 
i both agree and disagree with stivi and ollienotts. package holidays are a useful way to get to the island cheaply. i feel generally in the holiday market there is a class snobbery developing over AI

i always look to book independently as i can rarely do seven night holidays. however the quotes for very basic apartments/shitholes are usually crazy to plain extortionate. those landlords are as much part of the problem.

if there is a more cost effective way to get to IBZ than AI i take it. in last two years between me & mrs we have booked seven visits to IBZ....two AI, the rest independently.

every visit i go out to bars, go to restaurants (AI canteen stlye dining lacks finesse at times), vist cafes (mrs insists on passion cafe/skinny kitchen/healthy option on daily basis). we pay for sunbeds on beaches everyday as pools aren't our thing. in addition we go to clubs, so plenty of cash going in. this year cheapest option is the AI package which gives me more dough to spend in IBZ, not less.

not everyone who stays in AI locks themselves in the hotel.those who do i guess would do it wherever they are.

say someone goes to a self catered villa/apartment, buys their groceries in german-owned lidl and cooks in for their meals/makes picnics, are they any different to an AI punter?
 
I never understood all inclusive. Who wants to stay at the same hotel all week? Although this will cut out a large chunk of tourism to the island....families love AI. I think you’ll continue to see less and less numbers each season. Not sure if that’s a good or bad thing.
 
BaldEagle said:
Totally agree with this, was in Majorca for a stag recently and although it’s not my kind of place. It’s totally killed the bar culture there. The folk who own BCM have AI in all their hotels, basically people go from the hotel to the club and back with little in between.
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As I said I agree with the idea, but at the prices it costs to stay in sub standard accommodation to then end up paying silly prices for average drinks and food in a lot of Ibiza where will this custom come from?
I hope stivi eventually gets the time to reply properly because apparently the future is not as bleak as I think it will be.
But in all honesty all I hear in that is the typical attitude that I see when I look at Ibiza now.... arrogance and greed. :lol:
 
johndiamond said:
i both agree and disagree with stivi and ollienotts. package holidays are a useful way to get to the island cheaply. i feel generally in the holiday market there is a class snobbery developing over AI

i always look to book independently as i can rarely do seven night holidays. however the quotes for very basic apartments/shitholes are usually crazy to plain extortionate. those landlords are as much part of the problem.

if there is a more cost effective way to get to IBZ than AI i take it. in last two years between me & mrs we have booked seven visits to IBZ....two AI, the rest independently.

every visit i go out to bars, go to restaurants (AI canteen stlye dining lacks finesse at times), vist cafes (mrs insists on passion cafe/skinny kitchen/healthy option on daily basis). we pay for sunbeds on beaches everyday as pools aren't our thing. in addition we go to clubs, so plenty of cash going in. this year cheapest option is the AI package which gives me more dough to spend in IBZ, not less.

not everyone who stays in AI locks themselves in the hotel.those who do i guess would do it wherever they are.

say someone goes to a self catered villa/apartment, buys their groceries in german-owned lidl and cooks in for their meals/makes picnics, are they any different to an AI punter?
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Good for families, not sure much to the younger “going out” crowd in my view.
 
johndiamond said:
say someone goes to a self catered villa/apartment, buys their groceries in german-owned lidl and cooks in for their meals/makes picnics, are they any different to an AI punter?
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Interesting point.

stivi said:
don't have the time to properly respond right now
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This is a good convo.. so maybe it is material for a new thread. Most of us love Ibiza in some form, as most regular posters have been there multiple times over the years. Maybe instead of "What do locals think" it could be "What do regulars think" (or not, since that would define just about every other thread :lol:)
 
I think the discussion between stivi and ollie notts is a bit beside the point as no one is thinking about "erradicating" AI at the moment, just excluding alcoholic drinks from AI. Those people that will stop coming to Ibiza because of that weren't coming for the right reasons anyway and the island is much better off without them.
Families with kids staying in AI won't be much bothered about alcohol costing extra .
 
i was all inclusive 10days of july in san Remo hotel in san an thanks to a canadian spotlight :cool: , i didnt drink any booze except askin ice & coffees when leaving hotel :D..some breakfast 2-4 (10€ for people outside hotel, i was trying to sneak/invite @Nobbie Q but he was bust by staff, even i was telling , some bro is sleeping & he could have his breakfast? ),1-2 lunch , 1-2 dinners max along 10days

it's all happen outside the hotel, a band played there each night with a dj...but a lot of € to spend outside if u compare to all inclusive :lol:
 
My first visit to Ibiza I went AI at San Remo in the Bay. This was back when Group Playa Sol had a not so good reputation. It was pretty awful and I vowed never again. Ended up eating and drinking out most of the time as the food as inedible and the beers were served in a paltry plastic cup you get at children's birthday parties.
In 2016 I went AI again - this time in Kos - and my experience could've have been different. Didn't leave the complex - mainly because we had no additional funds - and it felt like we got our money's worth.
My Dad used to always say that the Spanish never quite got AI right compared to other destinations. In my limited experience, I agree.
 
el_loco said:
I think the discussion between stivi and ollie notts is a bit beside the point as no one is thinking about "erradicating" AI at the moment, just excluding alcoholic drinks from AI. Those people that will stop coming to Ibiza because of that weren't coming for the right reasons anyway and the island is much better off without them.
Families with kids staying in AI won't be much bothered about alcohol costing extra .
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There is much more to our points then all inclusive
 
OllieNotts said:
There is much more to our points then all inclusive
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agree.

the desire uplift in quality to 4 &5 star/ VIP will bring a reduction in punters. we're not all suddenly booking room only hotels to go and buy a €15 fruit juice at breakfast.

if you want big spending customers in big numbers you have to be on top of your game and offer exactly what they want. i'm afraid that an IBZ postcode is not enough to compensate for some of the shortfalls you see i the hospitality business of the island.


richer clients are able to go elsewhere easily so less likely to tolerate poor product.

i pay say €10 euro for a poor breakfast. i dont go back but someone will fill my seat tomorrow.

then the owner goes upmarket (ie rattan furniture / a flame thingy on terrace) and ups price of same brekkie to €25-30.

one rich person tells his rich mate restaurant x breakfast is rubbish and words gets about. its now uncool to be seen there, and there's nobody to fill the gap and the terrace is empty.

nothing wrong with going up market but you best make sure you can do it properly
 
white_isle_calling said:
My first visit to Ibiza I went AI at San Remo in the Bay. This was back when Group Playa Sol had a not so good reputation. It was pretty awful and I vowed never again. Ended up eating and drinking out most of the time as the food as inedible and the beers were served in a paltry plastic cup you get at children's birthday parties.
In 2016 I went AI again - this time in Kos - and my experience could've have been different. Didn't leave the complex - mainly because we had no additional funds - and it felt like we got our money's worth.
My Dad used to always say that the Spanish never quite got AI right compared to other destinations. In my limited experience, I agree.
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Food was OK, u have to spot food that was not ok, such beef :confused:, chemical juice, , cakes & so on.. i will say, hungry as hyena :Dafter parties ,'ve enjoyed my breakfast & lunch there :cool:
 
BaldEagle said:
Totally agree with this, was in Majorca for a stag recently and although it’s not my kind of place. It’s totally killed the bar culture there. The folk who own BCM have AI in all their hotels, basically people go from the hotel to the club and back with little in between.
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If you think people that used to go AI are suddenly going to start turning up in bars then you are sadly mistaken. The majority will simply take their business to another country. All research points to AI being priority for AI customers.
 
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this is a new thread to discuss - no party gossip and also thought I'd open a new one which is more general and maybe geared towards the future rather than the ibiza 2018 observation one.

first post from me coming in a sec...
 
okay so... before we actually discuss all inclusive, I think it's important to understand where it came from and how it ended up also invading the mediterranean. in my former life I worked in travel industry and thus know a thing or two about that.

all inclusive didn't start because someone thought it was a great idea to give everything away for free in a hotel, but rather out of necessity. AI started in tourism destinations where they had built hotels, but where there wasn't any touristic infrastructure around (bars, shops, restaurants...). classic examples are the red sea resorts (some of which then bit by bit did build touristic infrastructure around), some zones in turkey and tunisia and then also dominican republic (punta cana for example). oddly enough (sarcasm off) all of those destinations even to this day are low-cost destinations. they started at that and they still are.

now, when the families and clients with lower buying power started to see these offers, they obviously went. some clients love AI - for its cheap price, for commodity - you really don't need to take care of anything while there. but then again, a lot of people really feel quite emprisoned when there is nothing but jungle or desert around the hotel facility.

anyway so when suddenly places like balearics, the greek islands and many other destinations started to feel those 'new'-ish destinations coming up and being super cheap and 'attractive' because of the AI offer, a lot of places who had been running on the normal bed&breakfast or half board formula, switched and started to offer AI.

and while I understand AI is very convenient and especially understand it for families with young kids (there will always be pizza and pasta and french fries on the buffets - winner, plus you can always get that ice cream your kid is craving for), it has to be said very clearly: for a place like ibiza - and many other touristic destinations which have grown organically over the past 50 years or so - all inclusive is the pest. because it's obvious that all those restaurants and bars that had been built around the hotels to cater for the guests when there was only BB or HB to choose from, they all suffer. it also has a second bad consequence which is that hotel guests generally just don't leave the hotel as much because hey, if booze and food is free all day, and I have the beach right in front of my room - why should I go elsewhere? I'll get nicely drunk, chill on my sunbed (which is also free of course) and if I've got kids perfect too since the mini club is also free. sooo convenient. I know this last bit was tongue in cheek but it is what it is, lots of AI clients see a lot less of the destination they are in than other clients. it even has an impact on the clubs because, again a bit tongue in cheek...ah I am tired now, I should have gone easier on those G&T's pre-dinner...

now, I will respond more in detail about that in another post later or tomorrow, but to ollie's point above re 'the only affordable way to ibiza is AI' - ibiza obviously does have a pricing problem.

I'll explain more on that later.
 
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